Ice-T - Freedom Of Speech: Just Watch What You Say

Full transcript: Ice-T on London Real

1:54 This is London Real. I am Brian Rose. My guest today is Ice-T, the American rapper, actor, producer, and author.

2:11 You started your career as an underground hip-hop artist in Los Angeles before signing your first record deal in 1987. You’ve since gone on to release 15 albums, appearing in over 80 films, and star in NBC’s Law & Order: Special Victims Unit for over 20 years. Throughout your career, you’ve encountered controversy and protest, especially for the song “Cop Killer”, a commentary on police brutality and racism that was widely censored and ultimately led to your departure from Warner Records.

2:36 You’re considered to be one of the pioneers of gangster rap, always on the forefront of new messages and mediums, and your work has always been an inspiration to me. Ice-T, welcome to London Real. Thanks for having me, man. Yeah, it’s great to have you. I was wondering if I could kick it off by asking you some advice.

2:51 Would that be all right? Let’s start. Let’s start. All right, you’re the guy for this. So, I put out a video log about a week ago that was titled “Freedom of Speech, Just Watch What You Say”.

3:03 Absolutely. It was an homage to you and your album, and it was because I had just been censored, and I was angry, and I was kind of in protest. And just this is how this breaks down. On April 6th, I had a gentleman in the studio right here named David Icke, and we had a 2 and 1/2 hour conversation, about some controversial stuff. The coronavirus, the 5G, the vaccines, Bill Gates, all this stuff.

3:29 But it was two people talking for 2 and 1/2 hours, and Ice, it was the second largest YouTube stream in the world that day, second to only Donald Trump that day. Right. It just blew up. It was 65,000 concurrent people, and based on a previous episode I had with him 4 weeks earlier, it was four times as big, and when we did the numbers from his previous one, this would have been watched probably 30-some million times we figured as a video podcast, making it probably the biggest one in history, right up near Joe Rogan, Elon Musk levels, like 30-some million views.

4:03 So, we got done and we were like, man, this was incredible. It was a great vibe in the room, like some real serious thought. And then, 30 minutes later, it was pulled and deplatformed from YouTube. So, I’ve been doing this 9 years, having real conversations with real people, everybody from musicians to boxers to members of parliament to, you know, CEOs of billion-dollar companies, and this is the first time that ever happened. And so, my initial reaction was like, I was mad, and I started uploading different versions to YouTube.

4:30 I tried to get in touch with them, they wouldn’t call me back, and for the next 24 hours I didn’t get an answer. The BBC wrote about it the next day. They had already talked to YouTube. They said they took me off cuz I violated standards. And we got into this whole thing about censorship.

4:46 And, you know, for me, I just got angry because I thought First Amendment, freedom of speech, it’s two guys having a calm conversation, you know, and later I was banned on Facebook and Instagram, LinkedIn blew all my profiles away for sharing similar bits of that content. And I got angry and I thought about you, you know, with Cop Killer and how also they didn’t understand the nuanced conversation. Like YouTube said he was a COVID-19 denier, and I said, that’s not what he said, you just didn’t listen to it.

5:17 And so, I’ve been the last 2 weeks fighting this whole war, and all of my people around the world that watch us, millions of people have been fighting back, and I’ve decided as a symbol of protest to have him back on again, and we’re going to stream it on May 3rd, and I’m trying to get a million people watching this at the same time to make it the largest stream of a conversation in history. But we got to set up our own platform. So, we just did a crowdfunding raise.

5:41 Yeah. You with me? All right. I’m almost done. So, I was like, we can’t do it on YouTube, but man, this bothers me.

5:47 It just bothers me that they’re saying we can’t do this, and I know it’s a private company, and I signed the community standards, but it’s a digital platform that represents human speech in the world, and I think they need to respect some civil liberties. So, anyways, the end of it is that in last 48 hours, these people in a recessionary economy, when everyone’s broke, and I’ve never asked for a dollar in 9 years for London Real. I don’t roll that way. I just produce products.

6:11 They’ve, we just hit $350,000 to it for that fund. It’s going to take us 100,000 to probably stream a million people live. So, the people have spoken. We’re calling this the digital freedom platform, and it’s been this crazy thing that I’ve been wrapped up with, and I just thought of you and Cop Killer, and I feel like maybe YouTube is my equivalent of your Warner Brothers, because that’s my distribution network, but I also feel there’s a lot of political forces going in here I can’t understand.

6:38 I got government ministers calling me out. There’s Ofcom, a regulator here in the UK that’s trying to shut, you know, things down. And who better to ask about this than you? So, maybe you can talk about maybe your thoughts on this, and maybe even you how you remember it going down with Cop Killer. I just watched that interview of you and Arsenio Hall, which, man, is powerful.

6:58 I see a man with the weight of the world on his shoulders, and but also you’re representing on there. So, just curious for your thoughts, Ice. Freedom of speech, just watch what you say. Whenever you use somebody else’s platform to get your message out, you can be censored by them. If I write in a magazine and I turn it in, and that magazine has a guy called an editor, he’s going to determine what that magazine’s positions are, and if they want to let it fly.

7:28 If they think it’s going to mess with some of their ads or some of the people that pay to be on that site. So, what you did was you made some people uncomfortable, and it’s their platform. We don’t own the internet. Like people don’t know. Like you’re on our Instagram, you don’t own Instagram.

7:47 It’s theirs. Facebook, it’s theirs. Twitter, it’s theirs. So, they can just shut you down. So, you got, you’re still kind of playing in a censored world.

7:58 You know, you got to know that they still control it. Now, like what you said is if you create your own platform, then you can get it out. But, you still don’t own the internet. You see what I’m saying? So, there still could be somebody that can still come over the top and somehow shut you down.

8:16 The only time you actually have free speech is when you and I are sitting in front of each other talking directly to each other. So, it’s kind of like I learned I have the right to say anything, but I got to be prepared for the blowback and the ramifications of what I say. If I get on here and I say something considered anti-gay, I have to be prepared for gay people to attack me even though I would never say something like that cuz that’s not how I feel.

8:42 But, if I were to, they’re going to attack. If I say something about the cops, they’re going to attack. So, when I came out and I did that song, I was under the impression, oh, I have free speech. I could just say what I want to say and people will listen. Oh, no, I got attacked.

8:57 And I had to learn that. You know, I always say you have to be prepared for what you guys are going to put out. I mean, I tell people all the time you can’t go to your girl and say, “Hey, I just had your sister. Free speech.” You know, like there’s going to be a blowback to what you say.

9:16 So, all I can tell you is that whatever you guys are putting out, you can’t put it out expecting to use other people’s vehicle without expecting them to shut it down. And then, I mean, who reads those standards and practices and whatever they make you sign? You just click the button. You know, so we don’t really know what you can say on YouTube or what you can do on Twitter until you hit that wall. Just like me, I didn’t know what I could do on Warner Brothers until I hit that wall.

9:50 And Warner Brothers didn’t censor me. Everybody thinks Warner Brothers censored me. No, Warner Brothers put the record out. They just got attacked. They got hit.

10:00 And then they hit them in the pocket at the stockholders meeting. And of course, it’s a business. So they’re like, okay, if me and you have a big corporation and one person in that business is causing a problem and it’s going to make us lose, they’re going to have a conversation with you. So I decided to leave Warner Brothers. Warner Brothers never did one wrong thing to me.

10:21 They were victims of the attack along with myself. They stood up as long as they could. And I decided to leave so that I could be free. So this is kind of like what you’re doing. YouTube is playing the games with you.

10:37 You’re like, you know what? I’m not going to fight you. I’ll just leave and I’ll find another vehicle to put my message out. That’s just how it goes. Yeah.

10:48 And it’s interesting because, you know, they have these community guidelines, but they’re kind of enforcing them subjectively because there’s a thousand other videos that talk about the same thing, but it’s kind of their right. And I think what you found out with Cop Killer was there was a lot of things going on. It was an election year. There was pressure from the government and it was only happening because of other forces outside pushing it. And I know the same with YouTube.

11:11 They’re getting. Listen, listen, listen. It’s not YouTube shutting you down. It’s other people telling YouTube to shut you down. YouTube is just sitting back.

11:20 They’re not monitoring every video that goes out. They’re sitting in their office and then somebody raised hell that had enough power to make them shut you down, but it wasn’t YouTube. They don’t care. They got all kinds of stuff on YouTube. Yeah, that’s good perspective.

11:38 So, they’re. The question is, the question is who did it? Who put the pressure on them to shut you down? Well, you know, it’s crazy world right now where we’re seeing a lot of civil liberties rolling back. You know, it’s coronavirus time and the fears are escalated.

11:53 So, I think the governments are extra worried. And when people start talking about things that I don’t know. They think will fall, you know, foment dissents, you know, and get people panicking about 5G towers or maybe the COVID-19 is this or that, then they’re going to lock down a little more and I think they felt that pressure. I think, you know? Well, there’s so many conspiracies on YouTube.

12:15 I mean it’s crazy, you know? And like I, me myself, I’ve listened to so many. I’m that guy, you know, I make music. So, I listen to everybody’s angle. What I do know is that the virus is real.

12:30 Now, I don’t know where it’s coming from or why it’s coming, but I do know my friend died yesterday. One of my friends, a rapper named Fred the Godson, passed away yesterday. My other friend from Geto Boys, Scarface, he had it. He felt like. He told me it felt like he had 300 lb weights on his chest and he was coughing razor blades.

12:50 It took out his kidneys. Now, he’s on dialysis. So, regardless to what it is, it is real and you don’t want to catch it. And the theory that people, you know, he told me he said, “It’s your gang stay, can’t fight this, man. If you catch it, you’re going to go through hell.

13:06 Whether you die or not it’s a bad it’s a bad s***. Can I say that? It’s a bad, it’s a real thing. The virus is real. So, that’s the only thing that bothers me is people like, “Oh, well, the virus is a hoax.”

13:21 No, no, no, no. That’s not a hoax. Now, why and where and if it’s who if it was man-made or if it’s coming I’ll figure that out later, but right now you don’t want to catch it. That’s for the record. Right.

13:35 And you tweeted out the other day, “When the guns start firing, you run for cover. You don’t ask who’s shooting.” First. First. And those people think it’s fake, I’m like, “Go volunteer at a hospital.”

13:47 I mean, since you can’t catch it, since you’re immune to it, go right to the front lines. You know, they don’t need a. You don’t need a mask. You don’t need nothing. Just go right in there with somebody who’s on a ventilator, in a coma, be helping breathe.

14:01 I mean, basically whatever this disease is or this virus is, it suffocates you. It’s a wicked one. It’s a wicked one. And there’s been many before it. So, that’s all I’m saying.

14:13 I’m not the politician. I don’t know how they should handle it, but I don’t want it. So, I’m keeping my black ass in the house. I’m quarantine. And I don’t, I just don’t want it cuz if I’m not, I’m the kind of person that I learn from others’ mistakes.

14:31 If you told me you said, “Ice, they’re robbing people down that alley.” I don’t have to go down that alley cuz my man told me that they’re robbing people that I don’t need. So, when people, when somebody like me tells you, “Yo, I know people that have died from it.” So far, I know six people. Six.

14:48 Let me do the right number. Six people that have died. One of the guys worked on Law & Order: SVU with me. He was my wardrobe guy and he would come in. He was a 45-year-old Dominican cat.

15:00 Dead. So, am I trying to scare you? No, Ice-T doesn’t try to scare you. I just try to let you know what’s real. And you make your decision.

15:10 And I mean, just to quickly finish up on the Cop Killer stuff. I mean, how did you keep it all together back then when, you know, the president of the United States is calling you out and you got, you know, IRS and everybody, the cops looking at you. I mean, do you ever think and look back and remember how you felt at the time cuz there’s a lot of pressure you had? I was, I wasn’t really concerned with the government cuz I knew they had no reason to kill me.

15:34 They were misinformed in what I was doing. Cop Killer was a protest record. I was just saying I wasn’t part of some type of a militia that wanted to attack cops. I wasn’t sending people after the cops. So, they did their investigation on me.

15:49 But, when it got down to it, I wasn’t really concerned with the government. I was concerned with running into a cop lover, like somebody whose brother was on the force or somebody who had a family member who’s a police officer and I’m coming out of the restaurant and they want to pick a fight. You see what I’m saying? Those types of things can happen and then I got to defend myself and, you know, we don’t know how that’s going to end up. So, I learned that when you create beef, you always have to be prepared for the fallout.

16:20 I learned a lot from that, too. So, you know, I’ve explained myself. It’s been over 20 years and it was a protest record. The song was about police brutality. I think it was so radical because at the time y’all didn’t see the videos.

16:35 No one was aware of what was happening. You know, black people getting shot in the back and all this kind of stuff that, thank God, this the phone came out and everyone now can see. But, I’m singing pre-Rodney King. And the Rodney King thing was not something that just was rare. This is was their get-down.

16:58 This is how the cops were acting. They was beating people’s asses and calling back up and whooping people. And, you know, what do you want to do? You want to fight back to that. Now that they’re caught, I think the best thing that ever happened was the video phone, the videos inside the phone.

17:14 So, now every single person has to be held accountable because there’s other citizens watching everything you do. That’s the only thing that’s made it relatively safe. People is they know they’re being watched. And that’s police have to be policed. You sat on that sofa with Arsenio that you were ready to die for telling the truth.

17:37 It can happen. I mean, whatever you’re saying, there’s certain people out there, there’s crazy people that want to take action against you if you speak. I don’t want to die, but I know that’s possible when you speak out. You know, if you don’t want to cause any problems, just sit back and be very neutral on everything and be pop, you know, like pop music, pop sing what everyone wants to hear, say what everyone wants you to hear. But I’ve always been rock.

18:10 I’m a say what I feel and you know, I’m just aware. I’m aware of it. I’m not a. When I speak on it like I could die, I’m aware of that. I’m not thinking, oh well, I’m some guy that’s people are.

18:25 I’m not saying that to big my ego up. I’m just saying, yo, people get angry and I’ve gotten death threats my whole career. Me, Chuck D, all people like us, we get death threats and oh, we’re going to kill you if you come to this city, we’re going to kill you this that and the third, but I’m from the hood, you know, dogs don’t bark, they bite. You dig? Anybody got time to threaten me, I’m not worried about.

18:48 I’m worried about that cat that’s coming on a mission and he [snorts] ain’t telling nobody. That’s the one to worry about. Mhm. And you said there was also other factors going on because maybe it was the first time in history where these kids, some of these like white suburban kids were bringing your music home and these parents were kind of freaking out and I mean, I was one of those kids, you know, too that was getting hooked on your message and your vibe.

19:11 And you’re saying that was also part of that whole kickback as well. Well, the biggest fear on Earth is for us to all become friends. And all of us to understand, me to understand the plight of kids in Brixton. And what’s going on in London. And for London kids to understand what’s going on in South Central or in the South.

19:34 To where the media or whoever it is can’t just make us all enemies. You see what I’m saying? It’s easy not to like somebody that you don’t know anything about. I could tell you say, “Oh, we have all these people from Syria. These people, they’re immigrants.”

19:49 We don’t know anything about them. So, therefore, it’s easy to dislike them. You don’t know their struggle. You don’t know their life.” Music has allowed people to exchange their lives.

19:58 So, you say, “Oh, okay.” I got it. I know what a goth kid is. I ain’t got no problems with no goth kids. I mean, I don’t got no problems with this kid.

20:07 I don’t have no problem.” So, when the like you say this is a suburban white family is sitting down and dad sits back and says, “All those [expletive] in South Central Los Angeles are riding.” His daughter says, “They’re not [expletive] Dad. You’re the problem. And the police have been taking advantage of black people for years and years.”

20:26 And he looks over and he doesn’t realize his daughter has on a Public Enemy T-shirt and has an Ice Cube poster over a princess bedroom set. He doesn’t realize it’s been home invasion. The kids are listening to the music. And once you understand somebody, you can’t hate them as easily. So, I think hip-hop as a music has done more to bring the world together than any other music.

20:54 We never stopped anybody from doing it. Eminem is like the greatest rapper in history at this point, you know, from his skills and styles. The number one seller. We never We never stopped people. There’s kids in Brazil, there’s kids in London.

21:09 It was a movement that allowed the world to become part of it. And it’s your chance to tell your story. That’s all hip-hop is. It’s your chance to tell your story and hear mine. Well, how, how come that worked with hip-hop and then not with some other form of music?

21:27 Was it just because it came from a place where you could express yourself and say what you want and you were encouraged to be you? Well, hip-hop has five entry points, four entry points. You could be a dancer, you know, you could be a DJ, you could be a rapper, or you could be a graffiti artist. And the fifth element is you could just be a fan. And if you’re a fan and you know the knowledge, you’re part of culture.

21:53 The culture isn’t so complicated you can’t. There’s an easy entry level. Like you could be a dancer. You might be wack, but you can try. It’s not like being an opera singer where you have to hit level before you can even enter the culture.

22:08 With hip-hop, you can try to be a DJ and you know, we got a word in hip-hop called wack. We will tell you you’re not there yet. You’re wack right now. You got to get step your game up. But that doesn’t mean quit.

22:20 That means get better, you know? And it’s It allows anybody in, you know? If you can dance, if you can sing. All we ask is respect it. Respect the culture because it saved my life.

22:33 It saved so many kids lives, whether it be white kids, black kids all over the world. And we got haters, but see, hate is necessary for growth. Like I always told parents, I’m like they like, “Oh, well, I don’t like rap.” I’m like, “You don’t really like it, right? You want, you really don’t want your kids listen to it, yeah?

22:53 Make them listen to it.” Tell them, “Hey, you got to listen to your rap record tonight.” They’ll hate it. They’ll stop. They won’t want to do it.

22:59 Soon, soon you tell them that they got to do it, they don’t. So, it’s born in, in when we are all like teenagers and we’re looking for that level of rebellion and hip-hop is perfect. But, it’s really just a place to express yourself, which everybody wants to do. You don’t need to know how to play an instrument. It’s not difficult.

23:21 It just takes a little bit of practice. So, there I was, 1988 at Torrey Pines High School in San Diego in my ’68 Mustang and I’m blasting Colors out the window. And you know, this place, it’s like the Beverly Hills 90210 of San Diego this school. I mean, kids rolling up in Benzos. It’s crazy.

23:42 And I spent my previous years kind of in Southeast San Diego at one of these magnet programs where it was like 80% black and Hispanic. So, I was down there learning computer science and stuff. It’s how they rolled back in San Diego. And then I was there at Torrey Pines High School and blasting Colors and you know, from Colors when I was 17, ice to when I went to MIT in my junior year where we had this period called the inter-academic period where 6 weeks you had no school.

24:07 I spent 4 weeks with OG on repeats in my fraternity house while I painted literally a pentagram on my door. Like I know it’s kind of crazy story, but I did. And then the year a couple years later I listened to Home Invasion on repeat, but I used to. There was something about your music that allowed me to express and live out that rage inside of me as a youth. In a way where I don’t think I could have expressed it and I sure couldn’t have lived it out in a productive way.

24:38 And yet by reciting your lyrics over and over again in my head and walking around, it allowed me to I don’t know, be free, understand myself. And maybe you can explain this to me, but it was a big part of who I am today. Well, good music will connect to you. Like if you’re hearing a love song and you’re going through a particular moment in your life, that song will actually speak for you. And, you know, if you’re going through a rage period in time, well, heavy metal might hit the bone.

25:08 You might be like, “Yeah, yeah, you know, I want to.” Somebody was listening to the new Body Count album, and they’re like, “Makes me want to put my fist through a wall.” Like, “Okay, all right.” I think music is an accessory that goes with emotions. It’s something that builds your emotion, changes your emotion, but it’s good.

25:28 Because when you’re feeling a certain way, you’re kind of stuck here. A song will take you here, or take you here. It’s like it’s an addition to whatever you’re feeling. The best records hit a note in your head. Like, I’ll say something that you’re going through.

25:45 I’ll say something that you’re feeling, and you’ll be like, “That’s my record right there. That’s my record.” I made a record called All Love Is Lost a couple years ago. My son was breaking up with his girl. He’s like, “Dad, that’s my song right there.

25:58 That’s my song.” So, what I try to do with music is catch emotions, or catch moments in my life, or other people’s lives, that’s going to trigger those feelings. And that’s what a good song is. Good art it reaches off the canvas. Like, you can look at a lot of paintings, and you’re like, “I don’t feel it.

26:20 I don’t feel it.” But a good piece will trap you, and the art actually jumps off the canvas, and grabs you. That’s what good music does. Good music will just, it will take you to a place you were. You know, like, you might listen to Whole Lotta Love by Led Zeppelin, and you’ll be like, “Man, I can remember where I was.

26:39 I remember the girl I was dating. I remember the car I was driving. We played that all summer.” I can remember this record by, what was it called? The New Radicals.

26:51 Called You Only Get What You Give. [singing] That song, me and a whole and three gangbangers drove all the way to Vegas playing that on repeat singing that high part. We were singing and I’m like, “Yo, man, these guys are in a shopping mall singing this record and they don’t realize they got three Crips in a car singing [singing] It was way out, man. It was a moment, you know, but that’s music. Music translates like that. But how is a 17-year-old white boy feeling colors?

27:30 You know, I’m so removed from that environment and yet I just felt like I could connect with that kind of anger and rage and mis-misunderstanding. I don’t know, it’s still strange though. You can’t explain it. You really can’t explain it and that’s one of the beauties of music. Like I can’t speak cert- Another thing about music, it crosses language barriers.

27:50 Like we went to Russia. We went to Ger- We toured Germany. We toured in the Brazil. People don’t speak the language but they can say every word from the record. So you’re like, “Do you even know what you’re saying?”

28:01 That’s the only English they know. So it’s very fascinating but that’s the beauty of music. That’s why music will always be around because it’s part of the fabric of humans, you know? Anywhere you go, I don’t care what level people are, I don’t care how much money they got, there’s some form of music there. So it’s a beautiful thing.

28:22 I guess it started way back with the cavemen beating on a drum. But somebody said, “Hey, do that again.” He hit it once, boom. Somebody said, “Do that again.” Boom boom.

28:31 Keep doing boom boom. Hey, you know? And it just took off from there. Well, I guess at the end of the day we all want connection. And when you hear a piece of music, I feel like I connect with your soul.

28:44 And I guess your job as an artist is to be as authentic as possible so we can feel you without a filter without your ego getting in the way. Is that how you think about creating Ice? Because your fans are a different breed than fans of other hip-hop artists. There’s like they feel deeply connected to you or to what you’re talking about. I never thought I could make music.

29:06 I Being a musician was never any never in my realm of possibilities. I mean, I was somebody who thought I was going to rob them enough banks to be a big enough hustler that I was going to be rich. I was in the streets heavy. And I started reading Iceberg Slim and I started, you know, trying to live out his life. Now I’m emulating somebody in a book and then one day I just had this epiphany.

29:34 I’m like, this dude is a writer. Like I’m reading the words but really he’s a writer. So, if you want to be somebody, you know, all players, they want to be known and they want that fame, you know, so I said I had, I can’t just live the game. I have to document the game. Hip-hop was a low-hanging fruit.

29:56 It was something that I could try to do. So, I tried to teach myself how to do it. Little did I know that my raps people liked them. And they were like, man, do that again. And my content was real and people attached to them.

30:14 I had no idea that I was going to have that response. That’s why my first album was called Rhyme Pays cuz it’s coming from Crime Pays. I’m like, hey, hey, people like this. My second album was called Power because I realized these words have power. Kids in London are listening to this.

30:31 You got to remember you start making a record in your bathroom or in your closet in your little house wherever you are. Then you find out kids in Europe are listening to your words. Power. These words have power. And do you have an accountability or do you have a responsibility?

30:51 My only responsibility was honesty. Was like, I’mma be honest. I’mma tell you about this criminal life, but you don’t want to do it. Because most of my friends are in prison from it. So, I’ll tell you about it, but I’m never you know, glam sugarcoated, let’s say.

31:10 I mean, you say, “Well, you glamorize it.” Well, at the moment the crime is being committed is a glamorous moment. It’s an exciting moment. But, the kickback of it is the most negative thing that you’re ever going to run into. So, I always tried and that’s honest.

31:27 That’s honest. When you say, “Oh, well, you know, when you’re doing this or you’re selling drugs, you know you’re doing wrong.” No, you’re in a mindset where you think you’re doing the most glamorous, beautiful thing in the world until you get caught. And later as you get older, you understand it. Like, I’m watching movies now.

31:47 I just got finished watching Ozark and I’m looking at the movie like, “What were these people thinking?” Like, did they have one single happy day? Not one. So, [clears throat] that world isn’t something you want to get involved in. Unless that’s something that you if you really want to die young or end up in prison or, you know, I had to learn it.

32:12 But, unfortunately, music saved me, like I said. And that’s been my whole thing is to try to explain some of these places that you might think you want to go that I’ve been. And I’m here to say, “Stay over here. Do interviews with my man from London. Chill in the house.

32:29 Have some palm trees in the background. It’s safer.” Yeah. And you mentioned Iceberg Slim, and later I want to hear about you making that movie cuz that was epic, but I started reading Pimp probably on the back of knowing that you took on the ice name and you would talked about it. So, I mean, when I was on Wall Street, you know, in the ’90s, I had American Psycho in one hand and Iceberg Slim Pimp in the other hand.

32:54 And honestly, Ice, those were my manuals for life. I thought they were user manuals. So, you know, we’d use all the terms, we’d keep it icy, and then I’d be playing New Jack Hustler in my brain. I got a capitalist migraine and I would listen to all the stuff and, you know, like you said, it channeled the moment I was in at the time. I knew I was in this crazy game where it was about hustling.

33:13 Sun Tzu. You just needed the Art of War right in the middle and you were good to go. You were ready. Well, you know, in the movie Wall Street, you know, he’s quoting Sun Tzu, the Art of War, so I’m sure I heard that in the background, you know. But yeah, I mean, that became a big part of who I was and in the moment it all made sense.

33:29 And again, a bunch of your songs were just really resonating. And you know, You know, you have some great songs. I mean, and I guess everything you’re saying is so genuine, you know, the Rolex style and buck wild and cash piling and, you know, talking about intellectual high-tech cash and seven-digit checks and still breaking necks. I mean, I just, it feels genuine. Like you were actually doing that stuff and I could tell by the words.

33:52 It had to be genuine. You know, it’s kind of like I want to put you in that life, put you in that seat, put you in the car right next to me, but I’m always going to let you know that we’re headed for a crash, you know, because to promote it, like I say in OG, that invincible stuff don’t work. I’ll throw you in the joint, you’ll be coming out feet first. You know, don’t get carried away with this. And there is a high.

34:24 There is that moment when you’re in that world, you know, like you said, you’re in Wall Street and it’s going good. And then people say, “Well, do you feel bad about it?” And I always quote Fargo. I say, “It seemed like the right thing to do at the time.” So, when you’re in that moment, you’re not doing wrong.

34:44 You have to get away from it to look back and go, “Wow, I was real bastard. You know, I was a real problem.” And once I made that change and I decided, you know what, I’m not trying to hurt nobody. I’m not trying to rip nobody off. I’m just going to get what I deserve.

34:59 I’m not. It’s a big load off your shoulders. You’re not sleeping. You’re not looking over your shoulder. You’re not worried about it.

35:06 Then you get new enemies, you know, like these people YouTube and all them. You know, like really? That’s funny because that’s what people always say, “Well, I’m on Twitter.” And they like, “Are you, are you bothered? Are people by” I’m like, “Dude, can’t bother me on Twitter.

35:19 I’ve been through real s***. You understand me? I’ve been through things. This is just jokes. These are just people.

35:25 This is nothing, you know, in my life from what I’ve been through.” Yeah, you mentioned Original Gangster, and I’m wondering if you ever think about that album as if I mean it just still resonates. It’s still relevant. I was just playing a few tracks today, and it’s like, man, it still hits me so hard. Do you ever feel like maybe that record happened through you?

35:44 That you were channeling something else, and you just flew out. It flowed out of you because there’s something special about it. I mean, all my music really kind of I’m channeling. That’s why I did. I’m not the kind of person that could sit up and just write records like I got to get in the right mode.

36:02 Something has to trigger it. Like I’m like, “Yo, I’m in this zone.” Or something I’ll catch something, a vibe, or you’ll say something. I’m like, “That’s a song.” And I can go in.

36:14 Like one of my rhymes I say, I you know, I can sit down and write a whole LP that night if everything clicks. The trick with Original Gangster, it me trying to show people that there’s two sides to the gangster. Like if you look at the album cover, one I’m over here in shackles, that’s your textbook gangster. Next one I’m over here in the tux standing in front of a raw a Ferrari. Oh, that’s a businessman.

36:42 No, no. That’s a gangster, too. It’s, it don’t get it just because of when you see me, you see me over here like, oh, okay. It’s really saying no matter how you see me, I’m always the same person. Whether I have on a suit like you or whether I’m on a rock stage or whether I’m doing Law & Order SVU.

37:01 I always told people, they said, well, you used to be this, you used to be that. I said, well, let’s look at it like this. If you knew if you had a serial killer and he became a gardener, right? Is he a gardener or a serial killer that likes flowers? Mhm.

37:29 Our cores are our cores and we change a little bit, but I don’t, I mean, I can sit up here and talk to you, but you’re still that guy from Wall Street. Everything that happened to you all the way up through San Diego is still inside of you. That’s who you are. That’s what your core is. Now, you could be a different person now, but trust me, I wouldn’t make a mistake and think that that part of you was gone or missing.

37:57 It’s just there, you’ve learned how to suppress it and direct your energy in more positive ways. Yeah, you’ve always said you got to get yourself a legit hustle. I remember you saying that on Twitter or something and I was thinking, that’s what I was doing on Wall Street, that’s what I was doing here. I was just finding a legit hustle and that’s what you’ve said you’ve done with your career. When we were in trouble, the attorneys would tell us, they’d be like, yo, you know, you have a defense attorney.”

38:23 And they’re like, “Have you noticed we’ll never tell you to stop? We’ll always just tell you, you know, we’ll get you out. But that Rolex you’re wearing, I know I’m going to get it.” “All the money you got, I’m going to get it cuz you’re going to take that fall and I’m going to end up with it. And you know what I’m going to do?

38:41 I’m not going to send my kids down the same path as you. I’m going to send them to spring break.” So, you know, the legitimate hustle is the holy grail of hustling. Everybody, if you think you want to be on that side or in the underworld forever, you must not have seen the last scene in Scarface. You know, you must not know that this is not going to go down well.

39:06 But you take people like Jay-Z, you take people like Puffy, you take people like myself, you know, Dre, who came from Compton, came from the streets, and you see them make that transition now to being very successful tycoons. And that’s what it’s all about. And people like, “Well, you guys are black kids from the hood.” I don’t care if you’re Russian, I don’t care if you’re Jewish, I don’t care if you’re Italian, I don’t care if you’re white Anglo-Saxon Protestant, like the Kennedys.

39:39 Somebody had to hustle to get that foot in the door. And then you do the, then you transfer into this other world where you’re legit and you don’t have to cross the line. I would never tell anybody to break the law. I would never There’s kids that are fascinated with gangbanging and they just want to go gangbanging. I’m like, “Why would you do that?

40:01 You know? Why would you do that?” The kids that do it live in neighborhoods where they’re It’s kind of like forced upon them. But if you’re from a nice suburban neighborhood and you want to walk around and act like you’re in a gang, you’re an idiot. You know?

40:14 All the street cats are trying to get out. They’re trying We’re trying. Like now I’m in my place in Arizona. I got a nice little swimming pool. I got a nice little situation out here.

40:24 This is where we want to end up. I don’t want to be hustling my whole life like that. I’m legit now. My boys tell me they say, “Ice, you’re playing a police on TV is the best Keyser Söze in the history of the game.” And like I want to ask you about acting cuz when you first decided to be a cop in New Jack City, you were worried.

40:48 You asked your homies if it was okay cuz I think you were worried they might be offended and they were like can I get a part, right? I mean, you weren’t sure. Well, I, when they asked me to do that New Jack City, I was. That’s when I was doing the OG album. This is it simultaneously.

41:06 So, I got an album over here called Original Gangster and they want me to play a cop. At the time of New Jack City, no rapper had successfully pulled off an acting role. You know, Will Smith wasn’t out yet. They had done the rap movies Breakin’, Tougher Than Leather, Beat Street, but no rapper had actually done a dramatic role successfully. So, it was kind of like suicide.

41:31 Like I’m selling a million records over here. Why would I try to act and potentially destroy my rapping career? So, it was a dilemma. But you know, my friends were like, “Ice, man, we come from a background with no opportunities. If you turn if you s*** on these opportunities, you’re a sucker.

41:50 Because right now there’s an opportunity ahead of you for greater things.” I’ve later on had somebody tell me, “Yo, maybe your rap career was your audition for film.” That was your audition. You did a seven album, 10 album audition to where Hollywood looked over and said, “Hey, that guy.” So, and it’s funny though, people come to me and go, “Well, we want to get into acting and I’m like, well, I got in because I had sold a lot of records and they go, oh, so you got in the easy way.

42:19 I’m like, okay, if that’s easy, go sell 10 million records, you know what I’m saying? If that’s the easier route, I don’t know, but I had to learn to appreciate it. When I first started acting, I really wasn’t taking it serious. I was just doing it and then, you know, one time I was at a at a record store and I was looking through the records. People don’t know what record stores are.

42:47 This is a place where store records used to be. You would have to actually go in and buy them. And I’m looking through the thing and it was a guy there, he was maybe 65 years old working there and I looked in the bin and my record wasn’t in the front of the bin, it was in the back and I was like saying some grumpy stuff. And he’s like, Ice-T, man, he said, you’ve had a career that very few people ever will. There’s nothing you should be mad about.

43:13 There’s nothing. You’re in the bin. There, I got a whole back room of records back there that nobody wants, that they, we’ve taken them out of the bins. You’re still in the bin. And that’s when I, that was the moment I realized, man, I’m never going to, I’m never going to talk bad down on myself or feel any kind of way.

43:31 This man checked me right there. He said, man, you should never be mad at anything, you know? And I’m looking at him and I’m like, I could be working here. I could be working here. This could be.

43:42 He’s looking at me over here bitching about not being up front in the bin. It was like I was like, That’s a good check. And what’s the secret to acting? Because I mean, New Jack holds up. I mean, you know, you were you’re good in that movie and you continued on to do many more things and then 20 years is the longest running television show in history.

44:04 I, how did you do it? Longest running actor in history. Mariska is the long run. She out got me by a few episodes as actress, but longest running continuous actor in television history. I think first to act, you got to want to do it.

44:24 You can’t be reluctant. You have to be willing to do it cuz you got to be willing to suck up the information from other actors. When I did Surviving the Game, I worked with F. Murray Abraham and he had just won the Oscar. He said, “Ice, have you ever took acting lessons?”

44:39 I’m like, “No.” He said, “Don’t. It’ll mess with your mechanism. You are already acting with great actors. Learn from them.

44:47 Those who can’t do teach.” He says, “You’re working with working actors. That’s who you want to learn from. Pick up their techniques, their styles, what they do.” And I got to work with Denzel Washington.

45:01 I’ve worked with some of the greats in being on Law & Order for 25 years. It’s like being the most well-renowned acting school in history. I’ve worked with everybody. The trick to acting. Acting is lying.

45:18 Acting is being convincing liar. People say, “Ice, where did you learn how to act?” I’m like, “Stand in front of a judge.” I mean, acting is convincing somebody. Like if me and you were together and I said, “You’re my, act like you’re my manager.”

45:35 Can you pull that off? Can you convince somebody that you’re my man? It’s playing a role. The thing about acting is you don’t get to act like yourself. You’re going to have to be somebody else, but once you can do that, I got a good memory for lines because I’m a rapper.

45:52 So, I can memorize stuff. I’m borderline photographic memory. So, I can learn the lines easy. I think you just got to do it and you just got to hope people like you. You know, because there’s cats out there that can rap circles around me, that been to all kind of rap, I mean, acting schools, but for some reason when people see me on television, they like me.

46:13 Now, how do you make that happen? That’s the mystery. Nobody knows. I think there’s also an ish to acting, like, one time I was doing a photo session with a lady and I asked her about the camera. I said I’ve looked into so many cameras and she says you should take pictures.

46:38 I’m like, why? She said, well, all these cameras are the same cameras, but you have a different perspective on things. The way you see things, you’ll take different pictures. We all have the same cameras. It’s all about perspectives.

46:51 She said, whatever you do will be an Ice-T-ish shot. And when I started looking at actors, I’m like certain actors have an ish. Like if you watch Al Pacino is an Al Pacino-ish, no matter what he plays, De Niro-ish father, De Niro-ish gang, a Jack Nicholson-ish lawyer. It doesn’t matter. That little ish a Denzel-ish train conductor.

47:18 That little Brad Pitt added got it. That little is what people dig. Now, if you don’t have that, you become a character actor. You just But there’s something about all the great actors, they got something about them that people like. And you’re just lucky if you got it.

47:39 I can’t really say you know, it’s even like when you make records, you’re just like, I hope y’all like this. I hope you like it. I like it, but you’re sitting back like I was telling people we put a new album out. I’m like, it’s like having a baby. You go in that studio, you [expletive] it.

47:56 Everybody’s fighting. You. Oh, wow. Oh, this is good. Oh, we got a good day.

48:00 You got a good back. Then you finish the record. That’s the pregnancy. The reviewers that see the album first, those are the doctors. They look at it.

48:12 They go, “It looks like a healthy child. Looks healthy, healthy.” The day the record comes out, it’s born. That’s when you find out if it’s a healthy child, if it’s a sick child, or does the child have superpowers. You know?

48:24 So, until the fans see it, you don’t know. And anyone who sits back and says, “Oh, I’m just positive” what I do, people are going to like.” is out of their f***ing mind. You. There’s a sense a real humility that goes along with entertainment. You’re just hoping.

48:45 You know? And people who watching this, and some people put it like this. If somebody’s watched this far, they like me. Why the f*** would you sit this long listening to Ice Cube talk if you don’t like me? The haters have already left.

48:57 They left about 10 minutes in. You know, I didn’t say something stupid that they wanted to hear me say. So, now we’ve got an audience here that really gives a f***. And that’s why I’m going deeper into the answers. Yeah.

49:09 Well, speaking about going deeper, your handle on Twitter is final level. And we know you’re a big gamer, but I heard you once say that the final level is inner peace. Absolutely. And this is some of the deep game that you’re always dropping, and I want to talk about the daily game shortly, but I was wondering if you could maybe think about or tell me how you got that deep wisdom at a young age. And I know you went through some hard times when you were a kid.

49:37 I know both your parents died of a heart attack. They shipped you out from New Jersey out to Cali. You know, you got a girl pregnant in the 10th grade, and then the army. About, I saw you got I know. I know what’s up.

49:49 I read your book a few times. And then the car accident where you’re laid up in the hospital for, you know, a month or so when you can’t even move. 10 weeks. I mean, does that force you to go inside? Is that the product of who you are, a guy that has spent a lot of time going deep to himself?

50:09 No, I honestly, I’m going to tell you the truth. It really didn’t happen for a while. For a while I was like in the rat race like everybody else. I think I had to achieve stuff that I thought I needed to. And then when I got there, I realized that’s it.

50:29 It’s kind of like you’re climbing a mountain and when you get to the top of your mountain, you go wow. It’s a nice view, but what it’s If you’ve never been on a yacht, you could desire to be on a yacht. You. That desire will drive you crazy because you want it. But once you get on one, you might like it or you might not like it.

50:55 You might go, “Wow, this is like a hotel sitting in the middle of the ocean and there’s nothing to do here. And God forbid you bought it and you got to pay for it and you’re like, okay, I get it, but what do I do on this thing? I kind of just sit in the middle of the ocean. I get off on jet skis. If I’m not with the right chick, it’s a nightmare and now I’m stuck with her.

51:19 So a lot of things in life is just because people haven’t had that experience. They haven’t had the exotic sports car. They haven’t had this. They haven’t been. They haven’t traveled.

51:30 Once I kind of accomplished a lot of stuff, I was able now to really get back to what’s important. And I’m like, “You know what? Honestly, just not competing with people, understanding that my health and my freedom is the most valuable thing and loving my kids and loving that type of stuff is what really is valuable. And that inner peace moment is difficult to come to when there’s still a lot of desires. When you still have these desires, you’ll stretch yourself out over these desires.

52:09 It’s just a different. It’s a different place. I can’t explain how anyone that hasn’t been there can get there. It’s like me telling. It’s like I’ve been to Disneyland and I’ve, I’m good with analogies.

52:22 It’s like I’ve been to Disneyland and I’ve been on every ride and I’m ready to come out and telling you who’s never been there, you don’t want to go. It’s like you have to kind of go through these experiences to hit this place. And this place doesn’t usually happen till later in life. Till later in life where you know I’ve accomplished I’m one person that’s actually done everything he ever wanted to do. I accomplished it all.

52:47 I wanted to be a rapper, did it. I wanted to be a street hustler, did it. Make rock records, did it. TV, did it. Books, movies, I did it.

52:55 And I’m not. I never wanted to be the biggest star. I just wanted to do it. I just wanted the experience. So, now I’m just comfortable.

53:04 I could chill. I could play video games. I don’t need to hang my big chains out. I don’t need it. I’ve kind of come to this other place.

53:14 And when you reach that, I say that’s the final level where you’re no longer in competition with anybody. You’re just at peace. And also final level is the big boss in the video game. That’s where we’re all. We’re on that level.

53:29 When you hit that final level. And So, it’s two. It’s a mind state and it’s also where we’re all headed, I think. The big boss is where you’re always headed in the video game. You’re trying to get We’re all trying to get there.

53:47 Is there another level I’m at that I’m trying to reach? I don’t really see it in my head. I’m happy. I guess final level I guess final level is happiness. Okay.

54:02 Honest happiness. Do you have inner peace and happiness? Inner peace is difficult. It’s difficult because even if you get your life straight and you get everything perfect, so much in your life, you’re going to answer the phone and your friends are going through problems or you’re going to look at your neighborhood where you come from and they’re going through stuff or you want to your friends is going to die. It’s difficult because you’re always going to be bombarded with drama and chaos.

54:34 So, it’s a fight just to kind of stay mellow and stay in, you know, because you don’t want to totally isolate yourself to where you don’t care. One person wrote stress is caused by giving a f***. You don’t want to become so cold you don’t care, but you fight for it. I fight for peace. I don’t want drama.

54:57 I don’t want any problems. I’m just trying to do me. I’m not in compet- I think it’s the competition thing. I think the fear of you having more than me and all that. That’s the most wicked thing.

55:11 It’s unnecessary. And you’ve never been like that? Oh, I was like that. Don’t get me. Like I’m saying, I was like that.

55:20 If you pull past me in a car, man, I wanted to get a car like you. I was always like that, but in music I’ve never been competitive like I wanted to be better like me and LL battle back in the day and that kind of stuff, but it’s not as much as some people. I don’t think so. I’m not I’m not that guy. I’ve always had a fair level of confidence that I was fly.

55:43 I’ve always had a fair level. Like people were like, oh well, you know, this guy this guy. I’m like, I’m the flyest motherf***er in the world. I don’t really know who this dude is, but I have always had that energy that’s like, I’m I’m cool. And I’ve never been high-strung.

56:01 You don’t get named Ice in the, you know, for being an act person who gets aggravated easily. I’ve been very cool my whole life. I’m not that angry. If I got mad, you probably wouldn’t know. I would probably just get quiet.

56:19 And then I cycle it a different way. Like back in the day, I cycled it into revenge. You know, if you cross me, you get it. And then I’d be happy. Revenge was sweet to me.

56:32 Now, I’ve learned to let a lot of things go. I don’t even need, I don’t even have the energy to really send that negative energy out. Even though if something does bad happen to you down the road, I will celebrate. Where did you get that feeling that you were always fly? I mean, you know, as a child, you didn’t have a lot of things reinforcing that, you know?

56:59 I just had a lot of, I just always was cool. I mean, I always, I don’t know. I mean, you know, I was always able, I just had a gift of gab, I guess. You know, I could always talk. I never had problems with girls.

57:12 I always was able to have a fly girlfriend. I was always able to hook up with the toughest guys. And I grew up around a bunch of players that knew how to dress and knew how to talk and, you know, being fly was more important to us than being tough. We always wanted to look the best. We wanted to dress the best.

57:32 I like you got your. You look good. We always want to be those cats. I like that movie The Gentlemen that they just put out over there, Guy Ritchie. Yeah, with Guy Ritchie.

57:42 Yeah, yeah, yeah. And Those are. That’s the kind of gangsters we want to be. We want to be very sophisticated, cool cats. You dig what I’m saying?

57:50 So, that was just something I’ve always had and Bishop Don Magic Wand, famous player, he always said, “Ice.” He said, “Ice, man. Ice is one of the most wanted names in the streets. Everybody wants to be Ice. Ice, you are Ice.

58:07 Everybody. They call Cube Cube. You are Ice, man. Do you know? You going to have that name until you’re gone.”

58:13 You dig? And he says, “And you got to brag. Can’t nobody shut down, man.” You dig? So, you know, but I remember when I went through hard times and I’ve been through a lot of downs, a lot of downs.

58:30 You know, hustling, going up, coming down. And I remember. What were the downs? You know, there’s a down like when I used to sell tons and tons of records. And then records stopped selling.

58:44 You know, there was a moment when Public Enemy, Big Daddy Kane, Rakim, Wu-Tang Clan, we put out a record, it went platinum. Then there was a moment when all of us stopped selling as many records. And I had to ask myself, I’m like, “What’s going on? Like, what’s really on?” But because people that I thought were better rappers than me, like Kane and Rakim, when they weren’t selling records, I didn’t take it personal.

59:11 I’m like, “This is just a paradigm shift in the game. It’s not me. It’s everybody.” But I had to grab myself and say, “Yo, you, Ice-T, man. You got to be Ice-T, man.

59:26 You got this name. You got this reputation. Be that [expletive] man. You don’t cry, man. Players don’t whine or cry.

59:33 They figure this s*** out, man. So, I would just go back to the old players that told me, man, you know what they say, “Tighten up your boots, man. Get out there, man, and get it going, Jack.” You know, cuz you are not a loser. I think that’s the key.

59:48 You have to determine in your brain, are you a winner or are you a loser? If you feel you’re a loser, that’s a big turnaround and that’s something that you’ve put into your brain and it’s going to be hard to turn it. But, most of us think we’re winners. Well, if you think you’re a winner, then go win. Don’t just use it as a name or title.

1:00:13 Be it. Be about it. You know, if you say you fly, well, you get up in the morning, make sure you’re sharp. Make sure everything is right. You know, I’m.

1:00:21 You see me like right now on this, I’m. We’re on this quarantine, I’m in the gym. I’m about to get swole. I’m going to be bigger than 50 Cent when I come out of here because I know that when you are stagnated, you’re moving backwards. So, now you got to move something forward.

1:00:40 So, right now is a great time to read a lot of books. Catch up on stuff you said you didn’t have time to do. Like when you. People go to the penitentiary, when they always come out in great shape, it’s because their life is moving backwards, but they had to find something to move forward to keep them focused. So, right now my life is moving backwards and I’m up in the weight room getting swole.

1:01:04 I’m going to be buff. You see a 62-year-old man who look like I could smack the s*** out of you. Watch this. You know, I’m hitting the bag. I’m hitting the speed bag.

1:01:13 I mean, I’m like, I got time. So, I got to make it do something for me. I can’t just let it take from me. Well, speak on this, you know, coronavirus and the lockdown and you know, before we started we were talking about it being kind of a one big gratitude test. How do you see this and what’s the underlying message to humanity and what should people be thinking about on how to get through it, how to process it?

1:01:38 All that. Well, I can say right out the gate I’m guilty of kind of like even with Donald Trump was doing. I wasn’t taking it as serious as I should have. You know what I’m saying? I was like, oh, what, whatever.

1:01:50 You know, we had shows. I wanted to do the shows. I didn’t really understand how serious it was. And then I got the wake-up call. And a lot of times you don’t get wake-up calls until it happens close to you.

1:02:05 I always say it’s like the Jason analogy. Jason can’t get me cuz I’m not in Crystal Lake. So therefore I don’t got to worry about Jason. You know, he’s at Crystal Lake. So due to the fact this virus is in China and it’s here, I’m safe.

1:02:23 It’s coming to get you. So what happened was one of my close friends, Al P, my childhood friend, he got diagnosed with it and it scared me. Because you know, he’s in his late 50s. You know, we grew up together and I was worried about him. Then I heard Scarface caught it.

1:02:42 I talked to him. He told me he said, “Ice, man, I feel like I have 300-lb weights on my chest and it feels when I cough like I’m spitting up razor blades.” He said, “Ice, don’t play with this, man. This is real.” Like I said yesterday, my buddy died.

1:02:57 Since it happened, one of the guys from Law & Order passed that worked on the crew. I know six people personally and through friends that have died. What I do know is that the virus is real. Okay? I also know there’s a million conspiracies.

1:03:18 I’ve heard it from 5G, I’ve heard it from them creating it in China, I’ve heard it being a weapon. I’ve heard this, I’ve heard people that want us shut down population. I’ve heard it was all set up so they can sell the antidote or the vaccine. I’ve heard all this. I don’t really care.

1:03:44 I just don’t want people to catch it. I right now, I just want everybody to understand it is real and it will whoop your ass and it can kill you. And if it doesn’t kill you, you could bring it home to somebody that it could hurt. So, we got to be careful with this till we figure out. F*** a vaccine, I want a cure.

1:04:03 I’m not really with the vaccine. I would, I want to know that they can if I’m sick, they can cure it. That’s what I’m more concerned with. And you said it was like a recalibration of the world as we know it. Like, how does it make us think about ourselves, you when something like this happens?

1:04:20 Yeah, well if you want to get into more of philosophical look at it, it’s like everybody needed to get checked. Like, we all walk around, we breathe the air, we think everything is free, we think everything is the way it should be. But, we don’t pay attention to what matters. We’re not taking enough time to love our family. We don’t realize how important the environment is.

1:04:44 We don’t realize how we’re all connected. We’re all connected. This whole world is connected. You know, and it’s a wake-up call. I don’t think anybody when this is over is going to go back to life the exact same way it was.

1:05:01 They’re going to change their behavior. We’re going to social distance normally. You know, like people aren’t going to be all up on each other. This is just one event that happened in our lifetime. These events have been happening throughout history.

1:05:20 It just happened in our lifetime. There’ll be more in the future. I think it won’t catch us off guard like this one did. I think after this, all this money that people are putting in the war, we’re going to have a much better front prepared for this type of a disaster again. It can come from anywhere.

1:05:42 But like I said, take cover right now. You know, and learn to appreciate the things you have. Don’t spend your life worrying about what you want. Really appreciate the things you have. You’d be surprised.

1:05:59 Really take a look at it. You got a lot. You got a lot. Yeah. You know, just your health.

1:06:07 As players, we always used to say all a player needs is his health and his freedom and anything can happen from that point. You could be 80 years old and hit a billion-dollar lick and be a billionaire at 80. It doesn’t matter. And guess what? It’ll be right on time.

1:06:22 You dig what I’m saying? It doesn’t matter. So, it’s like but you have to be healthy and you have to be free. I could tell you right now, yo, I’ll give you 100 million dollars, 100 million pounds right now. You.

1:06:35 But you got to take cancer stage two. Nah. Nah, I won’t that. Well, let me cut off one of your hands. Nah.

1:06:42 So, you fail to realize how important this is. Our how much we value our life and our health. So, we have to make that first priority always. Yeah. You mentioned Trump.

1:06:55 What do you make of him? Is he a player? Trump’s a gangster. Trump is like a straight gangster. You know, his brain operates like a gangster.

1:07:07 The first thing a gangster, if we were joining a team the first thing I would ask out of you is loyalty. Loyalty and blind faith. Don’t ever question anything I say and you rock with me and we, that, look, now he stepped into our government doing that. I want loyalty. Don’t ask any questions.

1:07:28 I’m going to make the calls and all and anybody who didn’t go, who didn’t rock with him, got whacked. They, I mean, Trump’s got more people in prison from his cabinet than I have on the streets. All these guys are in prison. I mean he’s a [expletive] but somehow he’s managed to not get caught. He, I’ll tell you like this, Trump is the greatest arch criminal that we’ll see in our time.

1:07:56 He’s like a [expletive] Batman got to come after. You know what I’m saying? Like he’s not the normal. Like he’ll fire the FBI. He’ll fire the CIA.

1:08:05 Dude is, I mean, he’s wild. I mean I don’t even say crazy. He’s more like wild. Like the other day he was just on TV saying that they should maybe put disinfectants in people and stuff and shoot ultraviolet lights and [expletive]. I’m like, yo, doc, take it easy.

1:08:23 Like but Trump is a reflection on the United States. I always say if you ever watch wrestling have you ever watched professional wrestling? Yeah. And dudes [clears throat] are jumping off the top ropes and hitting each other with tables. The arena is full.

1:08:44 Cheering. Every night is cheering for these [expletive] in here wilding jumping. Those same people vote. Right? So if you know Randy Savage ran for president he possibly could because all you got to do in the United States is just be famous.

1:09:02 If you’re famous enough, people will rock with you, you know, and the problem with our presidency is no one who’s qualified wants to be president. No one wants that headache. Nobody wants that job. You’ve got many minds and great people that could be president that would take us to a better place, but they don’t want that job. The only reason to be president is you want to be president.

1:09:28 There’s not enough money in it. It’s a headache. I don’t. People ask me, “Would you like to go into politics?” I’m like, “Man, I got out of crime.

1:09:35 I’m, I’m not, I have my own platform. I pay my cable bill. I get up. I do what I want to do. I don’t have a bunch of people sitting over me telling me what to which is my album, and I yell my [expletive] and say my beliefs, and love them or hate them, but Nah, not politics.

1:09:56 So, Trump, Trump is wild. One of my player buddies told me, he said, “Ice, you got to understand, when you’re standing waist up in liquid s***, no one can see the dirt on you no more.” He’s so dirty that you can’t get any more dirt on him. So, he just. And now I’m just that guy.

1:10:19 You know, I’m that guy that I can have my supporters kill you on 5th Avenue. [expletive] SAID THAT. YOU HEARD THAT? HE SAID, “I CAN My supporters will shoot someone for me on 5th Avenue.” Like, no, he said, “I could shoot somebody on 5th Av- He said some wild mur- like some like De Niro type [expletive] and my supporters will rock with me. I’m like, “Yo, this dude is wild.”

1:10:43 But, that’s our president for now, you know. What can you say, man? I appreciate that assessment. You know, Ice, you posted a picture, I think, on Twitter or Instagram of you on a in Germany with like 50,000 fans and you’re rocking for Body Count and you’re like this is 62. Like what do you got to say about it?

1:11:03 I’m just wondering like how does that feel being 62 and doing something like that? And what happens at 72? The trip with age is your brain doesn’t age. Your brain still feels 21. You know, I don’t know how old you are but you’re not you’re not you know you doesn’t your brain still feel.

1:11:25 Yeah, the same. So your body you might get up and go hold up man. What the f*** is this right here going on? But your brain is still the same. Now I used to do martial arts and stuff.

1:11:38 So in my brain I can kick you in your head. Right? Yeah. But truthfully if I throw the kick it’ll probably land it somewhere on your hip some goddamn where, right? But in my brain I can visualize just knocking that s*** off.

1:11:53 I’m healthy, you know, I’ve always been athletic. When I was in high school I did gymnastics, I boxed, I think that just being active, you know, fact I get up every morning and go do SVU every day. I’ve never had a chance to sit on my ass like I’m saying this is the longest I’ve ever sat in years, you know, and I’m a real hustler. Like if I’m not making money every day I get physically sick. I get ill.

1:12:24 Like my brain is like I got to do something. And he was like, “Well why do you hustle so hard?” It’s like cuz I spend money at an alarming rate, you know, I’m like so. The cars. The cars.

1:12:35 Yeah, whatever it is. It’s cop and blow. You got to you win but you know, you blow, you spend it but you got to hustle too. You can’t just blow blow blow blow. Spend it spend it spend it.

1:12:47 No, you have to back that up. So I mean at 62, 63, I don’t really know. Ozzy’s 72. Mick Jagger’s 72 and having kids. You dig?

1:13:02 So, I don’t really feel like I’ll slow up until they actually pull the plug. You dig what I’m saying? I think I’m just going to go flat out like Miles Davis, like Quincy Jones. I think I’m just going to rock it out. And what I do know is that you don’t change.

1:13:21 Like real people don’t change. Like George Clinton will be George Clinton till he dies. James Brown was James Brown till he died. Ozzy will be Ozzy till he dies. Lemmy was Lemmy.

1:13:32 So, don’t expect me to change. Like it’s funny people like I’ll say something they’ll go, “Grow up.” I’m like, “Grow the f*** up. What are you talking about? This is it.

1:13:40 This is you. This is it for the rest of the way out.” But I’m just healthy. I was looking forward to touring this summer, summer. We had 30 shows set up in Europe festivals.

1:13:51 Hey, I don’t, I really don’t know, man, what it’s going to feel like. I just want to make it, you know, every year all I want is the next year. I’m not greedy. I just want one more year. And I’ve been doing that since I was like 21.

1:14:06 Just give me one more year. And I’ve been blessed. I’m healthy. I’m in great shape. So, we’ll see.

1:14:16 We’ll see. You mentioned Jagger having kids. You know, I’m turning 49 this year, but I just had kids about 3 4 years ago. First ones in my life. I had them late.

1:14:26 And I know you had baby Chanel a couple years ago. What’s that like having her in your life? And what’s it like having a kid late in life? Cuz I know you had kids earlier, Lil Ice and your first one is I think I honestly think men shouldn’t have, you know, for as a man, you shouldn’t have kids until you’re really done running. You.

1:14:45 They say when a woman finds the right man is the right time. When a man hits the right time, he’ll find the right woman. And I’ll add and start doing the right thing. We got to hit this place in our life where we’re done with the [expletive] And you can really appreciate that child. When I had my daughter, I was in the streets.

1:15:07 I wasn’t there. I was. It was presence over presents. I would give her stuff. She always had the newest sneakers and everything, but I wasn’t there.

1:15:14 I was in the street. When I had little Ice, I was just becoming Ice T. I was on tour. I was running around. I was dealing with groupies.

1:15:22 I was all out of pocket. You know what I’m saying? But I had a kid. With Chanel, all that nonsense is gone. All that growing, you know, cuz as a man grows he’s full of nonsense.

1:15:34 And then you finally realize what’s real. So, when I had Chanel, I was there through the pregnancy. I was there when she had the baby. Coco had the baby. Chanel still sleeps in the bed with us.

1:15:46 You know? So, I’m so focused on her because I’m not so focused on the other [expletive] no more. I accomplished that. So, now my biggest accolade is her. You know?

1:15:59 And really it was the best thing that ever happened in my life. The moment she was born, you know what the first thing that came to my mind was? I can’t die. I can’t die. Whereas, at some point you always feel like, oh whatever, blah blah blah, you know, living life.

1:16:19 Nah, now I’m like, I got to live 25 years. I got to be here. I can’t go nowhere. So, that was like a boost of like life for me. I changed my diet.

1:16:30 I just went into a whole ‘nother mode. So, really Chanel is like my fountain of youth. You know, she’s the reason I got to be here. For no other reason. I need another record.

1:16:41 I don’t need another TV show. I don’t need nothing. I just need to be here for her. Hm. That’s powerful, man.

1:16:48 Yeah, I feel the same way. I can’t imagine having kids in my 20s cuz it was all about me. I was trying to be me and got to get mine and I would have not been there, you know, and you see it. I think Michael Douglas had that first kid who ended up going to prison and then he had later kids with Catherine Zeta and he’s all over them being a real dad. I agree.

1:17:06 I think men shouldn’t have to couldn’t be allowed to have kids till you’re at least 40. Well, I wouldn’t say it’s smart. I tell women all the time. I’m like, you know, when you catch a dude in his 20s, he’s insane. He’s insane.

1:17:21 And when I do my lectures, I always ask people. I’m like, let’s think back to you when you were 18. What percentage of the things you thought were correct? Out of now that you’re grown, look back when you were 18. You were absolutely batshit insane.

1:17:37 So, to have kids in your early 20s and stuff, which I did. I had a kid when I was like 18 years old, you know? I just got out of high school. So, it’s you’re not really ready for it. You’ll step up to the plate, but you don’t know.

1:17:52 You’re still trying to figure. You’re still a kid. You’re still get. Men don’t mature. Men are really out of their minds at least until they’re 30s.

1:17:59 I think when they hit. Like my son is now 27. And now he sees 30 and he’s starting to get his s*** together. He’s like, “Dad, I need a pad. I Well, he has a house, but he wants a house now.

1:18:13 He wants, I want, I don’t want to be 30 with that.” It’s like this moment. And I think that happens for women, too. 27 is you can see 30 and you’re like, “I got to get out the club. I got to stop.

1:18:25 I got to stop.” Now, guys, the problem is at 27, if we get the house at by 30, we still got to pour a party now through our 30s cuz we got a house. So, we get it, we still got 10 more years. Girls and I don’t know anything you say about women or men they say it’s sexist, but women they mature sooner because life opens up for them sooner, you know, especially if they’re attractive women they get go out to dinners, they go to clubs. I didn’t get in a Mercedes until I bought one.

1:18:59 You know what I’m saying? But they life is kind of open to them. Like my wife by the time she was 22 she had done every [expletive] thing. I’m like, let’s go to the Jamaica. She goes, “It’s nice.”

1:19:11 I’m like, “What the f*** do you know ABOUT JAMAICA?” I’M LIKE, “LET’S GO HERE.” “OH, YEAH, it’s a nice restaurant.” I’m like, “What the fuck?” You know, so women life happens quicker for them.

1:19:21 Yeah. Ice, what was the best day of your life and the worst day? If you had to think about it. Oh, [expletive]. The worst day.

1:19:32 Mhm. I think the worst day was losing my moms. You know, as a kid and it was a very weird situation. My father passed later, but it didn’t hit me like my mother because of course you as a kid and I was sitting with my moms. We were watching Batman on TV in black and white, right?

1:19:56 When they climbed up the buildings and they weren’t really on the buildings. I remember that. Yeah. Batman and Robin pow that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1:20:04 So, and she just leaned her head back and she was having a heart attack and we lived in a duplex house and my father just sent me to the other side like to my neighbors and ambulance came and that was it. And in those days, you know, kids didn’t know as much. They just kept us isolated. You know, like I didn’t go to the funeral. I wasn’t around that.

1:20:31 They just kept me at another aunt somewhere else and you know, it was rough because you know, once you know your mom’s died, the question is what’s what’s going to happen? You know, now you’re in the unknown. Everything was a family. Now you’re in an unknown place and it’s a scary place and it was I don’t remember crying, but I know I was in trauma. I was like wow, and then when my father died I was kind of more prepared for that cuz my pops was sick and I remember when they took me into the, to the, I was in school.

1:21:08 They took me in the principal’s office and everybody had those faces like then once again, I had that same question like what’s going to happen to me? You know? And, uh, I ended up, that’s when I ended up going to LA. So I think one-two punch of losing my parents at an early age, that has to be the worst thing I’ve ever been through. You’d be surprised like the first time I’ve cried that I can really, I remember two times crying, but once the last time I really remember crying was when I lost my dog.

1:21:47 Spartacus died. That was hard. I was like yo, like I don’t feel like this over people, but people that have pets, they know man, when your dog goes, it’s like it was traumatic for me. And that might seem shallow, but I’m telling the truth, you know, when I lost my dog, that that really hurt me. Now, my best day of my life.

1:22:11 Did that trauma of losing your parents, did it give you something back like self-reliance or if you really look at your whole life, it must have also had a positive effect on your character somehow? Well, not out the gate. It’s f***ed up because you, you know, not having no brothers and no sisters or anything like that, it just makes life harder, you know? You’re very alone, and you’re an orphan, so to speak, you know? So, you’re trying to find a place.

1:22:41 You know, that’s why I get in the LA and getting around the gangbangers and stuff like that, that’s kind of like camaraderie. You find yourself connecting to that. And like, I never jumped into a gang. I never. But I hung with the gang members, and you know, having somebody say, “Yo, if anybody.

1:22:58 Anything ever happens to you, cuz, we going to kill them.” And them meaning it. That’s something you wish your father would tell you, you know? But so, I was. I understand that whole psychology of all these kids from broken homes finding and connecting to a unit.

1:23:16 But it, I guess in the long run, it just makes me never rely on anybody. Right. Nothing. Don’t rely on anybody. And back going.

1:23:25 Let’s go get balanced back to cop killing. When that s*** hit, I realized no one was on my side. Like, you are by yourself. Mhm. You can be out here.

1:23:35 You can act like you got friends, but if you get in trouble, you’re going to be by yourself. I don’t care if it’s all of us are in it together. Check this out. You got to. If I can get an attorney and you can’t, you’re f***ed.

1:23:46 I’m not getting you an attorney. Every So, it, like they say, you come in this world alone, and you’re going to leave it alone, you know? So, I just learned like I don’t really count on people. I got to get it myself. It’s my dream.

1:23:59 It’s nobody else’s dream. I can’t expect. Don’t expect anybody to wake up in the morning with your dream. You’re wasting your time. Whatever you want, that’s what you want, and nobody wants it like you.

1:24:13 So, it’s not going to happen if you don’t get it. I don’t care. You could be my best friend. Care about your dream. I care about my dream.

1:24:21 It’s like I hear it. I might help you a little, but I don’t wake up thinking about it. Oh my man, you I got to look out and make sure he gets what he need. That’s not how humans operate. So, that was my worst I read that a large percentage of billionaires are orphans though.

1:24:41 Huh. Okay. I read that. I’m I would be interested in actual stats on that, but I got that out of it. And my happiest day, happiest day.

1:24:56 I think that honestly the happiest day that I can think of is Chanel’s birth. Cuz I was ready. I wanted it. I was with somebody I love. And I was at a point where there was nothing else I needed, you know.

1:25:12 I had happy days other having a hit record, having this going gold or this or that, but I don’t know that baby was something special, you know. My boys tell me everything. They go, “Ice, never go back in the street. Never. Never will do anything again, but God forbid something happened to that kid, you know, everybody in LA is in trouble.

1:25:34 It’s going to be some [expletive] Everybody take cover. Leave that baby alone.” Good. And what scares you? And what scares you?

1:25:44 I think only thing scares me is something happening to my family. Like anybody. It’s real. You know, it’s the old somebody puts a gun on you and you go shoot and they put it on your wife and you like, “Hold up.” You know, I think we as humans care more about the people we love than ourselves.

1:26:01 So, I don’t want anything to happen to the people I love, my kids, you know, I had a terrifying moment with my son where he was in a robbery. He was involved in a robbery and apparently the guy was the guy that was doing the robbery told him to shoot him. And the gun jammed or maybe the, I maybe they were just playing and didn’t have a bullet in the gun. But it was a wake-up call for him. Like, yo, man.

1:26:35 This s*** is crazy and that terrifies me to get that phone call and something has happened to somebody I love. And that’s that gangster [expletive]. Gangsters know that. That’s why they always move on your family. That’s why they know that as men we not that scared of them.

1:26:53 But we’re scared. If I want to scare you, I’mma show you a picture of your kids coming out of school. That’s how I’mma scare you. That other stuff don’t scare us, you know? Cuz if you kill me, I’m just dead.

1:27:04 It’s nothing. But I don’t want anything to happen to somebody I love. That bothers me. So, yeah. That’s all that scares me.

1:27:12 I don’t have much hope for humanity as it stands, you know? I just think that humans want to be happy and everyone’s happiness infringes somebody else’s happiness. So, the theory that we could all get along is it’s not going to happen. Are we going to make it? Huh?

1:27:30 Are we going to make it, Ice? Nah. Have you ever seen a movie of the future where it was happy? It’s always post-apocalyptic. It’s always the end of the world.

1:27:40 It’s always like robots and [expletive] have taken over. I’ve never seen a future movie where it was nirvana. Where everyone’s like, “And the world just turned out so wonderful.” Aliens always come and f*** us up. Cyborgs.

1:27:54 Nah, I don’t think as a species we’re meant to live on this earth for you know, maybe you know, how many years have we been here, humans? Well, civilized 6,000, otherwise 200,000 they say. I think humans might get 20,000, you know? And it’s a wrap. And then there’s some.

1:28:16 Then there’s some re-wash, you know? Because we’ve already figured a way to kill ourselves over and over again. Think about it like this. If me and you were aliens, right? And we looked at the Earth and we looked at it and we said, “What’s on the Earth?”

1:28:31 You’d see water. You’d see trees. But then you’d also see these things walking around a rat sticking life into their mouths. They don’t eat death. They only eat life.

1:28:46 Like I say in carnivore, closer to death is considered fresh. Humans only eat life. So, these things eat people. Oh, I’m a vegan. Plants are alive, [expletive] Plants.

1:28:59 You eat life. So, we eat life. We kill each other for unknown reasons. There’s bombs going off on this planet we’re looking down at. We’re just destroying the environment.

1:29:14 And then you see animals floating in the water doing their thing and stuff. The first thing you and I would say as aliens is, “Those things can’t come to our planet. Whatever those things are walking around sticking life into their head [expletive] those things can’t come to our planet. We’ll bring all the rest. We’ll bring the water.

1:29:33 We’ll bring the trees. We’ll bring the animals. But that particular species, whatever the human thing, nah. Can’t make it here cuz that thing is savage.” So, the theory of us becoming [clears throat] unsavage, forget about it.

1:29:49 Turn on your Xbox, turn on your Netflix, and watch a good show. You know, hopefully we’ll make, we’ll be, you know, we got a few thousand years before that goes down, but maybe not. Oh, man. Ice, I was just finish with a couple questions I want to ask you. If you could pick up a phone and call up the 20-year-old Ice and give that young man some advice,

1:30:41 You know, I’ve been doing this show for 9 years. I spoke to nearly 700 people, and everyone always asks me, “Who’s the one guest that you want on?” And without hesitation, I always say Ice T. And so, it’s been a big day. Well, you just made, I don’t blush, but you just made me blush, man.

1:30:58 You dig? Oh, did I? Thank you. Yeah, that was a sincere statement, but you know, hey, I I am very, you know, honored. George was telling me, “Yo, yo, man wants to talk to you.”

1:31:10 And I was like, “Okay.” And you know, I always appreciate being able to talk to people that have a real interest, you know, cuz a lot of times we do interviews with people, they don’t even know who the f*** they’re talking to. You know, they haven’t done any research. They don’t know anything. So, how are you going to get into an educated conversation with them if they don’t even really do they do diligence?

1:31:33 So, you start dropping knowledge about me, I was like, “Okay. All right. I’m in the house. I’m in a good place.” I know it, man.

1:31:40 And when you’ve done a lot of interviews really quickly, you can find out if the interviewer is friend or foe. You can, you’ll. Here comes that [expletive] question. You’ll be like, “Okay, this is where this we are.” And then you know, that changes the whole tone of the interviews.

1:31:54 This has been a very friendly interview, so I appreciate it, you know? And it ain’t like I got s*** to do. I’m on quarantine. I appreciate it, too. I got one final request, Ice.

1:32:05 I’ve never asked anyone to do this, but do you mind if I spit a bar on one of your tracks? What, you want me to put you in the studio, or do you just want to rhyme to me right now? I just want to do it right now. Go for it. Say what you got.

1:32:18 Which one do you got? Here we go, man. Here we go. [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] WOO! WOO! That’s cold right there, man.

1:32:59 That was cold, man. Here, let me give you. Let me, let me give you one rhyme for the road, man. Here, with this, let’s go back since you bust some rhyme. Here you go.

1:33:10 Just something. I do 20-year-old rhyme for you, and you could tag it wherever, all right? Here we go. All right. I’m pulling it up right now out of my brain.

1:33:20 It’s somewhere back there. Let’s see. All right, here we go. [rapping] high-tech [clears throat] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] [rapping] Woo! Woo! That’s hot.

1:34:50 That’s hot. Ice-T, you’re a legend. I appreciate you. I’m sending you a tons of love from London. Next time let’s do this in person.