Full transcript: Christopher Divinity Dines on London Real
0:17 Hello and welcome to London Real. My name is Brian Rose. With me is the extremely good looking Mr. Nick Gabriel. And joining us in studio today is Christopher Divinity Dines. Welcome.
0:37 Thank you for having me. That’s a cool name you have. Thank you. Where did you get the um divinity moniker? an old friend of mine Eddie Gordon Kind of gave me the name as an idea and then everyone else started to call me that afterwards Wow It’s very cool. It’s a very cool name You know we um we put something up on Facebook about you And I described you as a life coach a former DJ and the author of two books one of them We have copies in our hand which is called the mystery of belief I’m just gonna flash that up there so people can see it Um, uh, you know, we don’t have, we have had a few authors in here, but it’s just kind of cool to sit down with one.
1:12 Can you talk to us about your journey through those things, uh, in, in respects to writing and things like that? When did you realize that you wanted to write a book? Was it something that was always inside you or? No, no, it’s, um, I, when I was a kid, I always wanted to play music. I was a professional DJ into 2006.
1:30 So, uh, the idea of writing books or, you know, giving motivational talks and things like that was I couldn’t comprehend that I mean I’m a high school dropout I still haven’t got any certificates to money and when I was at school I was either smoking dope or you know drinking and so I wasn’t really I’m not an academic but I think as a result of you know cleaning up my act when I was 21 I stopped the drugging and partying and things like that. Was there a specific point or occurrence in your life that said or that made you say to yourself it’s time to change my my course in life yeah yeah there was like I said when I was 21 I stopped taking you know drugs and alcohol there’s nothing wrong with people taking drugs and alcohol was just with me it’s not a good thing why is that you go too far yeah I go too far and there’s just always just chaos okay you expand on that it’s um I think I think if I look back in my experiences I don’t know where there’s a limit and I think when one is dealing with mind or mood altering substances to deliberately change away how one feels there’s got to be a limit so with me there’s there’s no limit with doing that and it was 21 years old because a lot of people start doing that at 21 but most people don’t start doing that at 21? Yeah yeah well I kind of started young but because I kind of digressed a bit but as a result of like stopping doing that and then developing or uncovering more of a spiritual way of doing things I started
3:13 Finding I was reading a lot more books it’s almost like the universe was saying right you got to catch up with what you’ve you’ve missed out what you’re meant to be doing your teens all of a sudden I found myself in my early 20s reading a lot of spiritual books, self-help books, books on personal development and then I found myself drawn going to these workshops, going to these events, going to these seminars and I thought I actually really liked this but at the time I was still DJing and then I thought well I think I could do what that guy does but I think I could bring a different angle and it just led from there. One person asked me oh could you do a bit of coaching for me or the next person says could you do a talk on this and it just developed and then one dad decided to just just stop writing notes and it turned into can you be a DJ at 21 years old and be drug-free I mean you talk about making this change in your life but I mean like can you really be in there at that age and be like say no I’m gonna stay sober tonight or even gets impossible yeah definitely I mean it if I’ve got quite a few friends that don’t drink and take drugs that are the top as a matter of fact you’ll find the big superstar DJs like super superstar DJs they they don’t drink or take drugs it just they have a tunnel vision and they’re just focused so I mean I was I was touring in Asia like Hong Kong when I was like 22 23 just sober I said to the promoters I
4:34 Don’t drink I don’t take drugs so don’t offer me that when I’m there I like you know you tell them what you want in advance so right make sure there’s a couple of bottles of sparkling water. Did you have a big bowl of yellow M&Ms? I don’t know sweets or just a bottle of Coca-Cola that would do me and they respected that because I was upfront and honest about it you know. Wow that’s interesting. Interesting story. How um you know I describe you as a life coach and it’s such a term these days I think people here they’re like they don’t know what it is or they’re like who is this guy to coach my life and you must get this question asked a lot. First of all what makes a life coach and then what makes you qualified as a life coach? That’s a good question. A life coach is someone that doesn’t really give advice. What it is is that I coach people, they might say right I’ve got the particular area so I want to advance in my career.
5:25 Well I’ve had a lot of personal experience of advancing in my career. I’m a self-made person, again I’ve got no academic work so the proof is there. because I’ve overcome a lot of stuff in my own personal life as well, a lot of demons, and I’ve mastered a particular area in my life. So that particular area is? That particular area could be with with addiction, with living healthy, I mean I could I could I basically live like an athlete. So that gives me credibility and people see that and you know once you’ve helped one person another person puts out there because if you’ve touched someone’s life in a positive way people don’t forget that it’s there for life you leave an imprint on their soul but life coaching isn’t just for individuals most of my life coaching is for companies whether it’s like sales companies they want their staff to advance but they don’t want it just to be a pump-you-up talk they want some some real juice some good foundation work in there and then we do public workshops as well which we have a spiritual foundation so like we were talking about meditation before you know we touch on meditation some people find that amusing going into a sales company and talking about meditation but I’ll just bring it to like just breathe deeply and that you must be relaxed if you’re gonna if you’re gonna pitch a cell you gotta be relaxed is that anti-sales meditation somehow you could look at it like that because sales you
6:54 Need to be aggressive or you need to be why is that no I don’t think it I mean a person think I have this expression that I’ve kind of formulated which is life tastes better with meditation and I think anything any endeavor that you do like if you if you connect it to yourself to your higher self you’re gonna do it better right I mean would you agree? Definitely definitely meditation promotes happiness stillness I can communicate with other people more it It amplifies my intuition, my intuitive thoughts, feelings. I feel connected and at one with the universe when I meditate.
7:35 And people find it easier to approach me if I’m calm. If I’m very anxious, then it’s the opposite because we pick up on that. We walk into a room and sometimes you can feel, oh, there’s a good vibe in here, walk into the next room and it’s like, I don’t want to be around that because feelings are a very powerful thing. did you first get into meditation because it’s not exactly something that probably when you’re 21 years old is like an option that’s right in front of you how did you find it how did you find it I suggested for me to do because I live by spiritual principles and have you always lived by spiritual principles or did this all kind of happen in your early 20s my early 20s before that and he’s I think I’ve always had a positive moral campus but like I said when you when you’re drinking a drug and partying all the time that it’s a little bit chaotic it was for me anyway but it kind of made sense you know I’m gonna live by spiritual principles it makes sense to meditate and a few people just gently suggested it and then I experimented I was doing it for a few weeks and then I wouldn’t do it for six months I’ll go back do it maybe for a few months I wouldn’t do it maybe for you know nine months but every time I kept going back to meditation it was it was it expanded and grew and that’s what I found with meditation. I can do set times but if I’m honest I don’t do set times it’s when I feel to meditate I meditate. I used to
8:57 Say alright when I wake up at 6 a.m. I’m gonna sit down and meditate for an hour I could do that but I just like to go with the flow the energy flow of the universe and I go by my intuition. Sometimes it’s better for me to meditate at midday than it is early in the morning so I don’t think there’s any rules when you should meditate even though a lot of spiritual teachers would say meditate at dawn. Wow. You know I was watching your Twitter feed recently and you just like put out a lot of this positive energy out there like once every you know a few times a day with your tweets and I’m just wondering what you get a lot of these thoughts you know some of your tweets recently were you had some that you had an article that you wrote out about positive thinking and I think you talked about Muhammad Ali in the boxers and how you could say being Being positive all the time is a cocky thing, but for you, you said reinforcing in your mind is a positive thing, and what do you come up with these ideas from what I’ve learned from others and then how that’s worked in my own experience because I learn from others and then I apply what I learn and then I have an experience as a result of that and then that’s what I pass on.
10:02 Could you give us an example in your own life of something where you’ve seen this mechanism in action? What the positive self-talk? Yeah, I’ll definitely Can you explain that just first? I don’t think everyone I know I sent that to Nick that positive thing But could you explain that one email you sent out about positive thought talk? Yeah poster analogy. You mean, okay positive self-talk and You know having a positive strong self-image If I have a negative self-image Even though some spiritual teachers will say don’t have an image because that’s that’s a form of building your ego, right?
10:35 Which is true But when someone has a negative self-image, and they’ve got negative doubts and negative limiting beliefs, the next step is to go with equal and opposite, which is a positive self-image. And it’s better to have a positive self-image than a negative self-image, because one with a negative self-image will cut themselves short from life. time could come from that, you know, always settling for second best. When someone’s got a positive self image, not feeling that they’re better than others, but just knowing in themselves that they can contribute something to life. And that’s a wonderful thing. Positive self talk is about repetition and reprogramming the subconscious mind. All of us have a subconscious mind. From when we are literally a day on this planet, we start to pick up other people’s other people’s feelings and beliefs and it goes straight into the subconscious mind. The conscious mind hasn’t developed yet. It takes about five to six years for the conscious mind to develop and you have the mental faculties, the senses that develop from that. Wow, five or six, okay. So we’re all programmed by the time we’re six and seven, by our guardians, our parents, our teachers, the people that we’ve spent time with. Television. Television, the media, radio, all of it.
11:54 And a lot of that is mostly negative unless one is born into an enlightened family. Most of us aren’t. I’ve got beautiful family that have a positive moral compass but a lot of the stuff I’m doing today I’ve had to learn it from other people so I’ve taken other people’s programming that I find to be positive and I’ve adopted it. Now that’s the first step. It does get to a point where maybe you don’t need a positive self-image because you’re doing meditation however I’ve even heard Eckhart Tolle say look when you start doing this stuff go with working on your self-esteem and self-worth and having a positive image work that’s your foundation because if you come from a very negative place you can’t just jump into feeling at one with the universe it doesn’t work like that that takes time you know it takes a lot of years of meditation and growing and evolving so do you think someone should work on positive self-image before they meditate? I think you can do it together. I don’t think there’s any set rules with it but if someone doesn’t have a positive self-image of themselves they’re gonna have the opposite of that because even though through meditation you could say all right we’re connecting to a place where there is no equal and opposite but we’re governed by the law of physics in this body so I’ve got a work in harmony with those laws. I don’t want to rebel those laws like I did in my teens because I’ll pay the price. What do you
13:23 Yeah, I am very interested in something I actually, on my own journey, I’m trying to figure out what the answer is because I used to be the king of positive thinking, you know, like I read somewhere when I was younger that we have approximately 60,000 thoughts a day. So I said to myself, okay, if I’m having 60,000 thoughts a day, I’ll do everything I can to make sure that as many of those are positive and conducive to helping me achieve what I’m trying to achieve in my life. I’m at the point now where I’m heavily influenced by OSHA and he claims that all problems come from the mind and what he’s saying is instead of trying to impose your will on this experience, you should instead try to just flow with what the Tao brings to you and that barefoot doctor mentioned that as well.
14:13 So I know from what you’ve mentioned earlier in this conversation, I can see that you have an understanding of that and I would, I’m interested to hear your opinion. I’d like to know how you reconcile those two different spiritual practices, I guess. You’re just saying don’t force all this positive energy into your head because you’re kind of disturbing the natural Tao. As Osho says, the mind is like a clock. If it swings to one extreme, it will have to swing back to the other extreme.
14:38 And his whole philosophy is just supersede that whole mechanism. Instead of worrying or living in the mind, just live in the spirit which supersedes that. That’s what I’m personally trying to do now, it’s not easy but do you have any thoughts on that? Yeah, absolutely. It’s a great thing you brought up.
15:07 I can’t function as a human being without the human mind. I can’t communicate or have this conversation without the human mind so my five senses operate due to the human mind, the fact that I can taste this tea that I’m drinking and things. So I’m dependent as a human being on the human mind. I don’t look at the mind as my enemy. The mind is a wonderful tool for me to co-create my reality with the universe, to contribute something special to life and all creative energy although it flows through the heart you know for instance if I’ve got an intuitive feeling and it feels right you know that’s coming from the place of my heart with integrity but then I use my mind to create in this reality. Meditation I find Like I said earlier, it brings me to be present, it helps me to be calm and alert, and it helps me to connect, I feel, with the universe.
16:11 So I try not to come from that angle, because that’s an extreme in a sense to say, don’t live in the mind, try not to, I mean that’s a very extreme statement. So I’m grateful that I’ve got this mind and this body, and I’m grateful that I’ve also I got the spirit and because it’s mind body and soul like we got a workshop coming up in September in London called mind body and soul as human beings were trilingual beings. So I need all three I don’t want to disrespect any one of them I’m grateful for this body because I can move I can walk what’s a typical day in your workshop like I mean What’s it like when people walk in because when I hear something like that?
16:47 It’s I can’t visualize what that’s like, but like some probably it probably room Maybe about three or four times a size. Okay, and who comes to these things are people for more walks of life such as We’ve had doctors lawyers with students from from Oxford aspiring actors and actresses City people, okay people that you know that practice meditation and what’s their goal in mind for coming to one of your Seminars it depends. I mean this workshop we’re doing now is called mind body and soul. So that’s to that connect with mind, body and soul.
17:22 So there’s harmony, because that’s where real bliss and wonder happens in life when the mind, body and soul is in harmony with one another. But we do like workshops like self-esteem or self-worth, or someone that comes from mind, body and soul workshop might not necessarily come to a self-esteem and self-worth workshop. We do workshops for, particularly say for like motivation, some workshops are to do with relationships. It depends on what we tailor for, And that brings its own audience.
17:50 So, ultimately you’re just trying to help people live better lives. Yeah, definitely, but that’s my buzz. Okay. That’s my self-esteem, I mean, yeah. What if someone comes and brings you a friend of theirs and says he has low self-esteem?
18:02 I mean, it’s such a general thing, but I mean, what do you do with that, you know? Um, well, first of all, I hope that they don’t say it in front of the person. Okay. Because then that creates an awkward situation. Hey, my buddy’s a chump. Can you fix him?
18:15 Yeah, because I took this course, it was this teaching for English language course, like a year ago and we had a guy in the class that was unsure of himself and everyone said to him they like you need more confidence get more confidence get more confidence and like that works yeah it’s like telling someone to relax who’s tense it’s like that just doesn’t work so I told him dude just have a plan so you’re confident in your plan and that might build but I mean how do you how do you start with a lack of self-esteem with self-esteem first of all I want to make sure everyone’s comfortable and relaxed like we have certain music playing and I have a few people at my workshops that come along and they’re there specifically to make people feel comfortable to make them tea or a cold drink to ask them how they’re doing to find them a seat if they need to know where the restaurants or bars are after during the break I want everyone to be relaxed and then from there I make it clear that I’m not I’m not an authority figure because I’m still a rebellious person today but I’ve learned to use that in a positive way so I make sure that I’m not coming across as as a headmaster and that I’m there to to help them and to share these techniques that have worked for me and thousands of other people that I’ve helped over the years and then that sets a good tone that’s important you know because if someone with low self-esteem they’re gonna if someone comes at them
19:35 Like you said if they’re barking at them it’s not good. Do you challenge them? I mean do you get in their face or do you challenge their feelings and say Why are you doing this or that or what’s your style? No, I don’t really challenge people in that sense I said I wouldn’t do that in a crowd either Because again, if someone’s got low self-esteem and someone’s Deliberately trying to challenge them about their feelings in front of a group that will make things worse So that’s maybe a discussion during the break if they approach me But I have a set format and then I’ll go the flow if someone wants to talk to me during the break then that’s fine Do you ever think it’s just a case, I’m sure Brian’s had this thought before, but I’m personally of the belief that in some instances, some people just need to be told, man, the fuck up, you know, sort your life out, stop whining, just…
20:27 I mean, I was going to ask you, because, you know, you teach people martial arts and a lot of people say that’s a great way of building some self-esteem and some confidence. I mean, so you must see it when guys come to you and you must see it either work or or not work with what you do? Well, I think, I mean, with what I do for sure, but I think for a guy like Chris, and I could be totally wrong, but we were speaking to Zach here about earlier, it’s people only change when they wanna change, you know?
20:55 Like, you can, I’ve got a buddy, Nick, I wanna lose my beer gut. How do I lose my beer gut? So I say to him, stop drinking beer, right? And then he’s like, you know, then he doesn’t wanna make the sacrifice needs to make. And I think a lot of people are like that. A lot of people just enjoy their self-pity and their misery. And until they’re ready to emerge from that, a course one help them, a helpful friend’s not going to help them. I mean, what are your thoughts?
21:21 I was actually curious what your thoughts were on that. Yeah, definitely. No, I didn’t want until I made a decision to change my life, then nothing happened. I heard people and I kind of knew that they were right, but I had to get to a place of it being bad enough. I had to be, you know, they’re saying, yeah, rock bottom or being sick and tired of being sick and tired. So yeah, fully subscribed to what you say. The advantage of having a workshop is that 99% of the time, I’d say the vast majority of people that come along, they want to get involved. They come to the seminars cause they, cause they want to get involved. I mean, otherwise it’s pointless cause they’re paying to get in for one and someone to come to a seminar, a workshop generally speaking, know wants to advance in their life they want to prosper they want to grow they want to develop they want to manifest you know goodness in their life it’s not like if I was to just walk down the street and just pull people up and say hey you know that’d be a different thing so generally the people that come they want to do the stuff. What’s the hardest case you’ve ever dealt with? There’s been there’s been a couple I mean it’s very difficult when when someone has a a child that’s in that’s banging trouble that’s difficult because I can’t feel what they’re feeling I mean I’ve had my level of suffering the question is you know how can we turn around their perception of what’s going on so if someone has a child that’s very ill
22:56 Or a child that has died. You just kind of empathise with that? Empathise, but there’s ways that they too can help others that are in that situation who have lost other kids, who have other kids that are ill. And that helps to, that will help to heal them and to help to heal those that are suffering that might not know as help. just help. So it’s about not running away from how you’re feeling. Okay. Embrace it and know that, you know, accept what’s happened. And I guess guys like Brian and I, I mean, especially with, with the kind of martial arts I’m involved in and the kind of martial arts Brian practices and also Brian’s role in the city where, in fact, Brian, I think I think you’re way more like this than me.
23:49 Everything in our lives is, I mean if I do something, I want verifiable, measurable, objective results. And it’s one of my big problems with psychology because you always hear about it, oh, I’ve been in therapy for five years. And it’s like, fuck dude, if you’ve been in therapy for five years, it’s not working. Your psychologist is getting rich of you. So my question to you, Chris, is what kind of success rate do you have?
24:16 Who come into your workshop and a year later they say Chris I’m a millionaire now and it’s all thanks to your workshop or Chris I had real issues with my mom but I implement stuff that I learned in one of your courses and that’s that’s handled is that how often does that happen that happens quite a lot I receive I receive a lot of emails every week from people I get a lot of letters a lot of phone calls a lot of emails of people saying thank you the thing is the the tools that we teach at our seminars and workshops and the tools that are outlined in my books are universal. So I know that they don’t just work for me. I know that they’ve worked for thousands of other people. I’ve seen miracles, literally, from people applying certain tools by changing their perception of reality. You know, when people come up and they give thanks, of course I’m grateful for that. But what keeps me detached not the right word I think what keeps me grounded is it they’re not my tools all I’ve done is I’ve applied them I know that they work and I’ve put them in a coherent manner so that other people can apply them so the stuff definitely works because I’ve seen I’ve seen too many cases but and it’s interesting you said that because I’m a lot of people talk about the results there’s lots of people in the self-help industry let’s say rights results results results and I did an interview not too long ago you know no one can
25:39 Control the results. Even if you look in ancient text, the bag of that Gita, you know, it talks about you can only control your actions, never the fruit. I don’t, I can’t control the effect. I can only control the cause, you know, cause and effect, action and reaction, you know, equal and opposite, cosmic law, sowing and reaping, karma, however you define it, they’re essentially saying the same thing, just different terminologies. No one can control their results because if they did there’d be no problems in life. What I can control is my attitude and my actions which create the results but never the results and the thing is most people in society are trying to control their results which is putting the cart before the horse and that’s why their results get worse that’s why they get more frustrated and that’s why a lot of things backfire where if one focuses on just doing excellent work like we’re doing an interview now three of us first time I’ve met the two of you we’re focused we’re here we’re present right now you know we’re not thinking about oh how’s it gonna look at the end we’re present right now so chances are there’s gonna be a good energy but some people will conduct an interview like this and rather than actually being present they’re thinking about oh how’s the editing gonna be afterwards and that will actually destroy the magic almost of something fresh happening. Is being present a big big big part of what you
26:56 Teach? Absolutely there’s a chapter in the mystery of belief called give and present, which is about intelligent giving, knowing when to give, when not to give, but that’s about being present with the universe. How can people be present these days in an era of Facebook and mobile phones and constant distraction? It’s possible, it’s just if I’m on Facebook, I’m on Facebook, so let me give all my attention to Facebook. When I’m not on Facebook and so I’m going to the kitchen to get a glass of water, let me give all my attention to getting a glass of water.
27:26 What about when you’re out with a friend of yours and he’s taking a picture of where You’re at and you know, he’s only taking it because he’s thinking about posting it on Facebook later. That’s almost what you just described here He’s no longer present in that situation He’s thinking of posting it on a buddy of mine had his girlfriend doing that all the time and he’s like You’re going to be taking a picture to post it later You’re not with me right now. Like what about something like that? Well, we all plan and And and this is a thing which you know you brought up. I can never get away from the fact that I’ve got a mind I can never get away from the facts. I have to plan like we’ve had to plan for today We arranged to meet at four o’clock in Old Street if we didn’t do that I could have turned up four hours later You could have turned up six hours later. So, you know, we all need to plan And and that’s important as well. Do you know Chris? I you see I’m not I’m not completely convinced that that’s the case. I think people like Eckhart Tolle and who is that by the way?
28:20 Eckhart Tolle wrote a book called the power of now. Oh, yeah Yeah, Eckhart Tolle, Krishna, Jesus, Buddha, I think that these people actually had superseded mind. I think they were, they lived in presence their whole, their whole lives. I mean, I could be wrong. And I mean, it’s, it’s a, I know it’s a state that I can never achieve, but it is the ideal to which I strive.
28:46 What do you, what do you say to that? I mean you’ve said it’s an ideal, you’re working towards an ideal, which is essentially planning something. That’s interesting. Look, I’m a human being and I do meditate and I do apply spiritual principles and I fully subscribe to spirituality, but you know, I’m a human being and I know my nickname’s Divinity but that’s just more kind of like a bit of tongue and cheek and also for marketing reasons. I don’t find it egotistic, that name.
29:23 Some people do. Really? Yeah, some people do. They haven’t met you before. Well, if you called yourself The Divine, that would be pushing a bit of any of these cool.
29:30 What do you think your biggest shortcoming is as a life coach right now? I mean, I think is the good thing about you is you’ve got so many more years to improve on what you’re doing. I mean- Yeah, how old are you, Chris? I’m 28. Okay.
29:42 28. So what is your biggest shortcoming, do you think, in what you do, as far as the life coach or an author? Or what would be the Chris you want to be in five years or 10 years? Or is that the way you think? Of course, I absolutely plan.
29:57 Leverage, I think, not I think, I’m leveraging myself more. I have no doubt whatsoever in my ability to execute what I get paid to do. That’s never in question. As arrogant as that might sound to some people. where I’m at now is I’m leveraging myself and I’m getting more people on board to help get the message out there through online and through vehicles in the media.
30:25 So I’ve always wanna advance. See, the thing is again, I live in a universe where energy is either increasing or decreasing and I’m energy. Energy is either growing or dying and I’m energy. Energy is either moving forward or going backwards and again, I’m energy, everything in the universe is energy. So I wanna be moving forward all the time I never want to be standing still because to stand still is to maintain and to maintain really is to go backwards.
30:48 It’s like if you’re maintaining a house just so that it doesn’t crack, you know, eventually the walls are going to crack. You know, I want to keep improving and growing and evolving. Do you have to go through some major life changes, do you think, to learn and grow? I mean, do you have to go through some more tragedy, do you think, in your life in order to become that better guy, that better life coach? That kind of thing?
31:07 I hope not. I hope not. Really? I mean, who wants tragedy? Who wants it?
31:12 Moments in your life have probably come from tragedy right? Some of them but then again a lot of them most of the best moments I had have not come from tragedy. I mean this is a good moment for me and I have lots of good moments and so most of my moments or time have you define it is not tragedy and I think that’s a good thing. Okay that’s cool. Now you’ve written two books I mean you know they say every person has a book in them but then some people say it it should stay that way, you know?
31:43 So I mean, like, you know, I thought of writing in a book and a lot of people, you know, probably think they had something to give, but you’ve actually made it happen twice. How do you go, how do you make that happen, you know? How do you actually get your thoughts down? How do you get them in a book, you know? How does someone go about doing that?
32:01 Through just, I don’t know, I could be sitting there, could be two in the morning, because I’m a night towel. My partner Mary, she’s trying to help me too. I’ve asked her, can you help me to try and get to sleep earlier? Because I’m a night owl. I remember all the years of DJing from a young kid just up very late.
32:19 So it could be two in the morning. I get some inspiration just to write. And I could be up till four in the morning. Sometimes it’s during the day. So when it comes out, it comes out.
32:29 I don’t actually plan to say write on this specific time I’m going to write, because the inspiration might not be there. And just getting the books out there, excuse me, is about, you know, First of all, I have to believe in myself to do it. You know, even the great spiritual teachers that have written like great articles, they had to have believed in themselves in order to put that stuff out. And executed. And executed.
32:50 Two different things. A lot of these spiritual guys that you were talking about can be very spiritual, but unless they got it out on paper, you know, it wasn’t gonna happen. People weren’t gonna know about it, so. Exactly. And so, is there any secret to doing that?
33:03 I think just, if for instance, you turned around Brian and said to me, I want to write a book and you’ve got insight and awareness, exactly what you want to write, then it’s just about believing that you can do it. Just believing and persisting and just believing to the end until it’s done. Self-belief is a powerful thing. That’s what the mystery of belief is all about. Self-belief, self-worth and creating a better life. Again, some spiritual teachers will say, oh, beliefs, you know, they limit you, but I don’t believe that Because by them saying that that’s a belief in itself and I can prove that because I can say to more is that what you believe And they’re not gonna say no So you’re gonna have to say yes, so it’s a belief so self belief is really important You must deal with a lot of people in the self-help industry And I’m just curious what what you what you see out there I mean as honest as you can be because that must be a crazy business to be in I’m sure whether whether we like to Admit it or not. I’m sure a lot of it is just pure bullshit and just charlatans trying to make a quick buck and you are clearly not that kind of person but I mean everyone the thing about self-help and I mean I’m writing a book you know it could be called the self-help book but what I’m always concerned about is the fact that a lot of people could just say well you know what gives you the right to say what you spoke about earlier what you addressed earlier it’s like what kind of
34:30 Authority are you to put your ideas out there, you know? I think you write that a lot. What do you think of the industry in general? There are some great people in the industry, there are some people that are charlatans, I call them leeches, and they want to prey on people who are confused. Yeah. And I mean, in my workshops, I mean, I’ve given away thousands of copies of my books to people that I know can’t afford even ten pounds to buy a book.
35:03 We’ve given books away to Africa, in America, and some people I know that really could do this stuff, that want to do this stuff. They haven’t got the money for the ticket for a workshop. They just walk in, and there’s no thing of that, because the foundation is just about helping people. So when you say you want to write a book, I know just being around you, and for the conversation we had before, you’re a genuine person. So the people that will say to you what have you got to say generally have low self-esteem they don’t believe they could do it what they’re saying is they don’t believe they’ve got something to say and you clearly have got something to say and I mean like the fact that you’re a master at martial arts and that you meditate and you’ll have all your life experiences that could benefit someone without a shadow of a doubt a lot of people and when you you mentioned that like people kind of projecting their own insecurities on you when they say why should you be your life coach or something like that How do you deal with hate and how do you how would you give advice to your people who deal with let’s just be honest Do with haters, you know, I mean, well, how’d you mean? How do you well people people that um, I guess that’s just a slang Yeah, so some guy says to you, you know, Chris isn’t the real deal. He doesn’t know what he’s talking about He’s only 28 blah blah blah. This doesn’t work. Yeah, he doesn’t work
36:15 How do you do with that? And then how do you recommend your clients to deal with that? Well, I find that very amusing if you must get some of that, you know that that amuses me I mean it makes me laugh. If what I’m doing jars a few people, that makes me laugh. It doesn’t bother me. I’ve got really thick skin. I learnt too from DJ in nightclubs. The self-help industry is very competitive, but trying to break the London circuit as a house DJ when I started off in the 90s, if you get a good gig, then all the other DJs that weren’t not all of them but a lot of them would be you know bitching and slagging you off and saying oh this person’s rubbish and that stuff. I’d find it amusing I mean if they’re saying if some the thing is I know the work I do is real right it’s real and it works and it works for lots of people and it’s going to continue to work for lots of people. Now if some people want to say you know negative stuff which they know isn’t true I’m still relevant in their mind they’re still talking about me they’re still thinking about me you know if one person wants to tell 50 people in the room Oh Christopher Dines is his stuff or his books are rubbish or their shit or whatever there’s 50 people that know my brand so I look at a positive with everything you know do you think a certain amount of that is a sign of success when you when you get some eating I’m not sure I mean there’s a question I’m constantly asking Nick and asking myself I don’t know
37:47 Possibly, you know, yeah, I think if you if if everyone likes you you’re not pushing hard enough, right? Like you’re not pushing on blood I agree with that. Do you agree with that? Yeah, definitely and I can’t be friends with everyone. Not everyone’s gonna like me and And I don’t like everyone either and I’m not gonna like everyone and and I’m not seeking to be liked by everyone because that’s called people pleasing and that creates a lot of disaster for a lot of people desperately wanting to be like to be accepted, you know That comes from like an inadequacy of their own, like wanting to be liked.
38:21 Is that something you talk about people pleasing in some of your workshops? Sometimes, yes, sometimes. You know, I’d love to go to one of your workshops because you’re describing them, but I’m having a hard time getting my concrete mind around them. But like if it was like two or three things that you talk about in your workshops, like avoid people pleasing and let’s address that. Like for people listening, how would they get more of a concrete idea of what it’s like to be in a Christopher Dines workshop because without being- Are you all dressed in white robes?
38:46 Yeah, I’m dressed in white robes. I wear rock jeans. Do you get people chanting, do you get them standing up? I mean, like, what are like some of the two or three top things that you like address? To create a, first of all, they need to know, they ought not need to, no one needs to do anything.
39:04 If they know what they want, that helps. You know, it’s often say to people in advance, when you come to the workshop, just try and figure out what you want from this workshop. Like a goal. Like a goal, exactly, a goal or a dream or something. That makes it easier and then, but again, it depends on the workshop.
39:21 It depends if you’re talking about a goal achieving workshop, it’s very different from a self-esteem workshop because a self-esteem workshop, I have to be a lot more, I don’t have to be. I choose to be a bit more gentle in my opinion Because you’re dealing, you know, someone’s coming to a self-esteem workshop, you know that if someone’s down don’t kick them That’s what that’s what I believe Wow unless they’re really pissed you off. They kick them three times What um, I’m just curious What do you miss about the old days of DJing and shortage because we were walking over here and he’s like yeah He’s the DJ around here. What what do you miss about that?
40:01 The probably the thrills the thrills of I I say I missed it I went in 2009 I was getting these kind of like nostalgia and these fantasies about what it was like so I went and DJed in Camden at the loft and I was doing a few other nights down there and I found I’d lost my love for it but if you’re talking about what it was like ten years ago no if you’re playing to a couple of thousand people it’s great I mean I used to do 18 or whatever or younger 18 19 when I was 18 I was DJing at Garage City, which was a big KISS FM night. That used to be at Bar Rumba. I did City Loud at Turmils.
40:39 Turmils was closed now. I did the ministry many times, and it was just a great buzz. And then you got the Pyatt radio stations, and I believe they’re still going. And you lost the love for that, though, when you went back? I lost, I went back in 2009 for a couple of months, and it wasn’t there.
40:53 That’s interesting. You know, it- I guess you shouldn’t force it if it’s not there, right? Exactly, and I learnt, I learnt. Have you heard about, there’s a movement which has now been made into a documentary. A documentary TV has been made about it called Electronic Awakening.
41:07 I can read about this. No, I haven’t. No, apparently, you know how we all started, humanity started in tribal cultures, small tribes of 50 to 150 people. And they used to commune with nature through drumming or music and dance, right? And the music was usually characterized by a loud drumming beat.
41:30 And so apparently the premise behind Electronic Awakening is that the rise of rave culture and electronic music is a way back to that, all of us, right? This is how we’re reconnecting with each other and the earth. And I thought that was really cool. I mean, what are your thoughts on that? Well, there’s some truth in that, for sure.
41:52 I just missed, I started DJing in 1994. If I was born, I just had a conversation with my friend’s partner about this, my friend’s wife and some of their friends. If I was born five years, say I was born in late 70s, I would have caught that acid house kind of rave culture. And there’s no question about it. Now, before that in London, people were fighting.
42:15 I mean, it was just rough. It was rough and tough. And you had people, you had football clubs all fighting with each other. Then the rave scene came along and everyone was like hugging, clapping and dancing. And it was in the field.
42:27 It’s in the club scene in London in the early 90s, early mid-90s, with just magic. We’re actually going to an event at the end of the year, one of our guests is hosting called The Big Om. I don’t know if you’re aware about it. I’m not. So Barefoot Doctor, who we’ll introduce you to, I’m sure you guys will get on like House on Fire, he’s hosting this event, where is it exactly?
42:47 It’s gonna be at Wembley Arena, which I think is at Wembley Arena, which is next to Wembley Stadium. It’s gonna be 12,000 people. And at one point, everyone’s gonna be chanting together in the same place, and it’s gonna be electronical music, and then some Tai Chi performers, and he gets over there and does these voiceovers of like, it’s really cool stuff. It’s gonna be kind of positive energy. Yeah, that’s got your name written all over it, Chris, you’d love that.
43:10 When is it, when is it? 12th of the 12th, 2012. We’re gonna be there. I might have to come to that. Now check it out, you would like his vibe a lot.
43:17 I was wondering, Chris, what do you do for fun? I was watching some of your tweets. I know you’re a Mayweather fan, boxing fan. What do you do for fun? Do you box or?
43:25 I don’t box. I like watching boxing. Why is that? I like the sweet science of boxing. And I just like the energy of it. I like the energy.
43:41 I think a lot of it’s against the conditioning. My grandad, Frank Dines, he died a few years ago. He was very into boxing when he was young. He actually used to fight when he was younger. So I think when he was watching like the Ali fights and the Sugar Ray Leonard’s in the late 80s and I was around there, I was probably about four or five, it goes in. I think unconsciously it’s a way for me to kind of feel maybe connected to my granddad in some way. But I just like it, I mean I like martial arts as well and I’m getting more into that.
44:13 Boxing is a martial art, no matter what anyone says, in fact boxing is probably one of the best martial arts, it’s incredible. You spoke about the sweet signs, if you watch a high level boxer just shadow boxing that is an individual who has complete mastery of his body absolutely yeah completely especially if you try boxing and then you try sparring against a boxer you realize real fast that yeah your shadow work is I think he was just unsparring before oh yeah loads of times probably you know the stand-up stuff I have so much appreciation I mean jujitsu is a lot of ground game and that’s a whole nother art but boxing a lot of respect for it and I think I started boxing in the late age like 30 and I think that’s too late I think you need to be doing it since you’re 10 years old like those Cuban kids do but even the training of boxing I mean I do a lot of the training with that I do personally and that is that just keeps you fit I can’t I mean I go four rounds in a ring and that’s one thing I imagined I can’t imagine 12 rounds I just can’t comprehend that that’s lethal can you imagine 12 rounds bare knuckle yeah boxing used to be bare knuckle until 18th century yeah and um you didn’t say what do you do for fun. I can just see it’s like, on my breaks, I like to go and heal more people. No, what do you do?
45:28 No, on my breaks, I kick back. I like watching the film. I don’t go out as much as I used to. If I go out, I mean I go out. I go all out. Not drinking and drugging, but I mean I go out. I like going to restaurants, walking. I like walking in nature and spending time with family and friends, it’s really important to me. You know, family’s important friends.
45:54 You know, listening to music as well. I still love that. You still like music, yeah. Yeah, I still love music. I had a weird question that just kind of came to me, and I don’t know if this applies more to you, but if you had to write your own obituary and make it say 30 words, make it really short and specific, you know, and hopefully it’s not going to happen any time soon.
46:10 But what would it be, you know, and not generally like he was a great guy, but what, you know, what would you write or what would you want it to be? I’ve never thought of that so this is the time I’d let I don’t know because I don’t I can’t see How I see myself isn’t how other people see me so Maybe how I see myself Isn’t really relevant to how other people would see me and vice versa So if any if one day someone decided to write 30 words on Well, I’ve contributed to life, if that’s what they feel to do, that’s great, but that’s the furthest thing from my mind right now. Ryan, what would Joe say?
46:50 Yeah, and I was going to ask you as well, here lies Brian Rose. Bad motherfucker. Extremely good looking individual. Extremely good looking corpse in our days. Oh, it’s tricky because you think, well, what am I going to be 60 or maybe it’ll be tomorrow or 80?
47:04 It’s hard. I mean, is it going to, it’s hard to write your own obituary, isn’t it? realize Brian Rose who, you know, helped the world, uh, introduce them to the beautiful art of podcasting. You know, it’s, it’s, it is a tricky one because it involves part of your ego because like you said, we all plan. So to say that you’re not thinking about that is probably not true because you do plan about being about a person and doing the things.
47:25 Yeah. But I’ve never thought of some, what, what other people are going to write about me in years time. Well, the thing that comes to mind when you, when you came to my mind, when you ask Chris that question is I once read a little piece which said live your life so that when you die even the undertaker is sad and I thought that that was kind of cool you know fuck it dude when you’re dead you’re dead you might as well just make this the best life possible right so what do you think yours would be mine what I would like it to say is he lived the most alive life he could have yeah I mean it’s a ridiculous sounding state but I want like yeah I want to really and we’re here we’re alive let’s fucking you know let’s experience it let’s just grab it by the balls and do it right come on that’s good answer it’s a tough question because you have to wrestle with a lot of things in your mind when when you answer that thing yeah um you know guys we only have a few minutes left I just want to seriously that yes it’s no no come on um I was wondering if you have any questions for us or anything you want to talk about that we might not have covered um sure I mean what direction do you see this show got me I’ve had a great time today well when thanks and you said on the way over here you’d seen about three of our previous episodes which I have to say I think are three of our best ever you know I don’t know if we’ll
48:50 Catching us driving. Well they were until this one right? Yeah that’s true. I bet you say that’s all it gets. This is episode 31 and I remember after Nick and I did the first one I sat down and we were like we got to make this consistent and you know we have which is crazy. It seems like a lifetime ago. I know and we’ve done one every week pretty much non-stop and we’ve had just completely interesting people on every week and I think we’re growing as people and we’re having fun and we’re meeting like some of the coolest people in London to be quite honest. The coolest people in the world, man. Yeah. And I’d say that and it’s like, and people I would have never met before, ever, you know, or I would have, I just wouldn’t have had such a cool conversation with him as well. You know, you love London. Oh yeah. Yeah. I’m a Londoner, man. Regardless of my accent.
49:33 I mean, don’t get me wrong, Chris, I do struggle with it sometimes. You know, it’s a grimy, like overpopulated city, but at the end of the day we have our fingers on the pulse of the universe. right living here. Yeah we do, we do. How do you feel about London? What’s your relationship like with it? I like it, it’s edgy. I mean some parts in London, as you said, I don’t know, what I find in London is every town’s got a different vibe. Like we, you know, if we were to kick it in shortage tonight and then decide oh let’s go down to say Chelsea about 11 o’clock, it’s a totally different energy and I love that. Oh yeah, we had a guest on here and he said that. I mean there’s probably a hundred different London’s where you can go everywhere. I mean you You could go to Stratford, you could go to Bethlem Green, you could go to Shortage, you can go to West End, further west, north, south.
50:17 You know what I was thinking the other day, I was watching the new Sherlock Holmes film. Okay. You know, and it’s like… Game of Shadows or something. Yeah.
50:26 That was… Was that Elizabethan London? What was that? It was late 1800s. Okay.
50:31 So what was that era called? Industrial Revolution. Victorian. Victorian, sorry. Yeah.
50:36 So, you know, I was watching that and I was like, wow. That was grimy. That was grimy. Then I was like, fuck. I live in that city.
50:41 This is this is the same city and it in a hundred years time They’ll be looking back at like you should be more horses than people in this city Everything was horse drawn everything, you know, it’s incredible black cabs were horse drawn. Everything was horses everywhere See that in Sherlock Holmes, you know, they said quite a time back then but I mean we called the show London Real I don’t know. I guess cuz Nick and I are here in London I mean, I’m American Nick is South African, but for us, this is a show about London and we love it I tell black cabbie sometimes they’ll hear my accent. They’re like, where are you from?
51:10 I’m going to be like, I’m a Londoner, mate. Yeah, you know what I always tell people is- Tries and crazy. I always tell them, I’m from Cape Town, but I was born in London. And so like, is there any area in London that you would like to see better? That’s a good question.
51:26 To get more, to learn more about, you mean? Just generally to improve London. Or to improve it, to see it improve itself. Yeah. Well, that’s basically like saying, do you think any parts of London are shitty?
51:37 Well, I think the east end, I think we’re seeing a huge change with the building of the Olympic Stadium in Stratford. Have you been down there and seen it? I haven’t, dude. So it’s stunningly beautiful. And like five years ago, it was a waste dump.
51:50 The guy said it was old refrigerators and they had to clean the soil because there was oil and basically toxic waste there. They rebuilt the whole thing and built this beautiful stadium. So like, I’d like to check it out. I love to see the changes that are happening and it needs to continue. And I think it will.
52:02 But I mean, if you think it’s Soho back in the day in the 1800s was like one of the nastiest places on Earth, one of those densely populated cholera-infested waters when Karl Marx lived there, you know, you forget how the urban centers change, you know. Soho’s got a good edge now. Yeah, it does. Like, you know, the bars and stuff. Used to be seedy, didn’t it?
52:22 It did. There’s some parts that are still seedy, but I avoid those places, you know. You know, Christopher, how do people get in touch with you and how do people buy your book? What can you tell them or follow you on Twitter? Can you just give us your info?
52:34 Absolutely. Someone feels to follow me, our Twitter is at divinitydines or you can go to Christopher.com or just type in Christopher Dines on Google or you can send me an email and I’m on social media. Okay. Cool. And we have your book, The Mystery of Belief in front of us, but you have a second book which is called?
52:54 I have the book before that was called A Ticket to Prosperity and then I’ve got another book coming out either at the end of this year or early next year, which is about manifesting your bliss and happiness and bringing joy out into the world. We’re going to get this guy in touch with Sonya Debelle as well. Yeah, I’m sure she’s going to want to grab him for a guest as well. It’s interesting you said about manifesting your bliss and getting a lot of other.
53:18 I think a lot of you later, your Twitters seem to be kind of saying a lot these days, the tweets and pushing all that positive energy out because it comes right back at you. for the joy of doing it. It’s a beautiful thing. On a serious, I mean, this might sound a bit mushy to some people, and that’s fine. But for real, like, when you see someone’s face and their eyes light up, because maybe you’ve just given them a little, you haven’t told them what to do, you haven’t advised them, because I don’t give advice, but you’ve given them some genuine encouragement without thinking of any financial compensation whatsoever.
53:52 That’s great. I mean, who doesn’t like earning money? I love earning money. I find I get a lot of joy though when I do stuff to give back for like if it’s charitable work or just meeting someone on the street and talking and just giving some encouragement. That’s priceless.
54:06 There’s no feeling better than when it comes to actually being a service. Yeah, it’s a reflection of the divine, right? I mean, we’ve all been given this amazing gift of life and this experience by the God energy and when you do the same, when you give someone something, you’re being more divine and more Godly. So I completely understand and I completely agree with you. And it’s pure and it’s selfless and it’s just bam.
54:30 Yeah, it’s nice. It’s good for everyone. Dude, that’s all good. Christopher, thanks for finding us, you know, through the powers of the almighty internet. We have all met today.
54:38 So thanks for finding us and thanks for coming on the show. It was really good getting inside your head briefly, you know. Thank you so much. Cool, man. It’s about the journey.
54:46 It is, man. Take care, guys. See ya. Thank you.
