Tom Kirkham

Full transcript: Tom Kirkham on London Real

1:09 This is London Real, I am Brian Rose. My guest today is Tom Kirkham, recent graduate of our Broadcast Yourself accelerator. Welcome. Thank you very much, it was a pleasure. It’s a pleasure to meet you. It’s pleasure to be here, just all the way around. It’s always fun to go to London anyway. So tell us a bit about you. Where you from, what do you do?

1:31 Oh wow, we’re in, my friend. I’m a native Louisianian, right, so fourth or fifth generation, but when I was six months old my dad moved to Washington DC. He was a civil engineer, like, so a little bit of similarities with your background. But we moved around a lot when I was a kid, but mostly in the US South, right? So there was, of course, we lived in Virginia, Florida, Mississippi, Arkansas, and then later on I moved back to Louisiana, back to Arkansas, and that’s where I am now. So I’ve lived in Arkansas by far more than anywhere else, though.

2:06 Okay, and I just missed you down in Tennessee from my Ironman. We were a couple hundred miles away from each other. That’s exactly right, I thought about that. I was in another intensive training session. I bit off more than I could chew, I took two or three on at one time, but yeah, I thought about that. I thought it was kind of ironic that we were so nearby, at least in the same state, the Whiskey state. So what it is. Yes, yes.

2:28 And what brought you to want to broadcast yourself? What was that thing? Had you been thinking about it for a while? Well, I had actually done it. I had a podcast, and I think I burned through about 10 or 12 episodes, and I had a radio show for four years even before that, and I really enjoyed it. But if you did it for me, I didn’t know, I knew what I did with the radio show, and I quit that for other reasons, not because I didn’t enjoy it and not because of the ratings or anything. It was just circumstances.

2:59 But with the podcast that I’d begun, I didn’t really see the purpose in it. I didn’t know where I was doing it. I was doing it for the fun without having an overall goal and something to really look forward to, and it’s just wandering. And so when I came across you, I think I’ve heard of you on the Andreas Antonopoulos interview that you did, and I’ve never followed you before, or never, that’s the only video I think I’ve seen of yours, so I hate to say that, but that’s it.

3:30 But anyway, I went to the webinar, you had a webinar jam and all of that, and what it allowed, there were things that you said in there that, yeah, I got the technical parts. I’m pretty much comfortable with microphone, talking to people, interviewing people, or just talking by myself for an hour. But there were other things in there that really made me realize you’re going to short-circuit or time compress my learning curve for the bits and pieces that I don’t have.

4:00 So for those that are listening to this, if you think you know everything but you’ve never made a successful business out of it or anything else like that, there’s bits and pieces of the course that you’re gonna be able to take and expand on. Of course it never hurts to talk to anybody that’s in your trade or your business to get more ideas. And so with the intensity of the course, because you’ve got it just nailed down, there’s a lot of homework and everything like that.

4:30 I saw it as a way to get me off of some of my habits, is to overanalyze everything, wait for it to be perfect, wait for it to tie in with another endeavor that I’ve got. And it was really the biggest thing that I got out of it was just do it. Yeah, I mean, just do it, right or wrong. Don’t wait for perfection, that’ll never get done. And that was one of the biggest things I got.

4:54 But there’s other things, and even last night, when we were all talking, I got another idea that actually kind of wrapped everything up for the podcast that I’ve begun, First Principles. Okay, you want to share that idea with us? Well, I think kind of silly, but so I have this IT company, and I’ve always thought of my podcast as something else, right?

5:19 So I have these other passions, these other interests, and I always thought it is something else. I said, waiting, that I’m passionate about that too. Why am I not just leveraging that and using it? Because I did a webinar couple of weeks ago, there was the, for the IT company, and I just, I nailed it, knocked it out of the park, and a lot of those were the experience that I got during the course.

5:40 And I said in SOL last night that it just hit me, so wait a minute, why am I doing something else right now? Why don’t I just go ahead and button this up and wrap it all up with that company, and then I can always bridge it out to something else. It’s a little slow, sometimes I’m really slow on things like that. There’s others, they were in the class, already made that connection, right? That was like day one: oh, I can help my business out. It was the exact opposite for me.

6:04 But that’s what an epiphany really is, when you just realize something that in retrospect seems so simple, but you have to get these weird things happening to get you to connect the dots, and then you’re like, oh wow. Yeah, I mean, you never know where that serendipity comes from, right? Yeah, sometimes it may be just talking to an Uber driver. Yeah, it’s bizarre, man. You got to keep your mind open to those ideas. It’s about the synapses and being open-minded, and sometimes you can get inspired by just the strangest things and the strangest places.

6:35 Yeah, coming to London can help to get yourself in a different light. Traveling, for that very reason. Yeah, changes your game. Why London Real? Why trust us with this experience? I just saw no reason that I, well, your passion, your energy, your attitude just come through so clearly on the webinar, that you’re presenting the programme on. And yeah, sure, I could analyze that, I can check references and things like that.

7:10 But at some point you’ve just got to just do it. I would have been over analyzing and then I never would have pulled the trigger. And I’ve come to the realization, as you have, that you just gotta jump in with both feet and just do it, and just accept the fact you’re gonna make mistakes. You’re not going to get ahead in life without taking risk. The bigger the risk, the bigger the reward. And don’t beat yourself up if you fail. I mean, you just, okay, I learned, that’s a learning experience.

7:35 So I invested whatever it is, and I could go back through my life, you could go back through your life, and you can just go down the list: okay, that experience, that education, that was a $10,000 education, this was a $100 education, this was a $50,000 education, whatever it may be, and you just look at it like that. No one’s perfect. And so when you, you get paralysis if you start thinking of things that way.

7:58 So if you think you’re one of those people that always want to improve yourself, and you think that you might want to jump into broadcasting, this is a great way to do it. It really, you’ve got to work hard each week, and it’s very fulfilling and it’s very worth it.

8:17 So tell me about that first week. I drop you in this group with these 150 people from around the world, I’m asking you to upload the video, accountability doc, you got me live calls twice a week. You know, that first two weeks, like, for you? That’s a really good question. Video was the one thing that I’m still not real comfortable with. I’ve been on television a couple of times, but mine was always sound, right? The podcast was sound, radio shows sound, so that took a little bit.

8:44 That was pretty easy though, once you do a few of the Zoom deals, man, you get over that real quick. But here’s what I was doing: my brain’s just working too overactive. I immediately started taking the accountability docs and starting applying it to my other endeavors. So I’m taking and creating my team in the IT company: here’s an accountability doc, we’re gonna start ripping apart. Let’s say take the sales and marketing team, we started ripping apart Chris Voss’s negotiation book, building a worksheet on it.

9:16 And then the operations side, we’re getting these new security tools and things like that. Okay, you guys got to go through the training, you’ve got to go through deployment, knowing how to put it in the client’s site, because these are very powerful security tools and we’re trying to protect our clients as best we can. But I’m holding you accountable, and your peers are going to hold you accountable, by hitting this goal this week.

9:38 So we’ve got weekly meetings, attendance yes or no, did you complete the before training videos for this particular security product. And so I’m simultaneously doing that while I’m also doing the class, so that I got a lot of value out of that. I started immediately applying everything to other parts as I saw it. So what is it, the… about, okay, so famously, well, the genius of steal, forgot the first part. But yeah, I know that one. Oh yeah, it’s about artists, I think, anyway. Oh yeah, great artists copy, good, no, good artists copy, great artists steal. Right, yeah. Well, it’s a great form of flattery.

10:17 What would you biggest struggle on the course? What was hard? It was really about time management, because I really had taken on too much, and I’ve got a lot of moving pieces in my life. Other than that, if I didn’t have anything else going on in my life, I would have hit it out of the park. I don’t have a nine-to-five job. I’ve managed to get out of any of the endeavors that I’m, I’m just, others parachute in. I don’t mean to be flippant about it, but basically it’s more of a let’s have a productive meeting, let’s make sure we got direction, and all of that.

10:51 And I was fortunate enough to have a lifestyle like that, so it would have been very easy had I not undertaken some of these other endeavors of the last time. But I know that probably most of the people, I guess, have jobs or they’re actually running their business, and it’s time-consuming for them. So you’ve got to take it serious and commit the time to it. Time was really the toughest part for me, though.

11:15 Okay, talk to me about the community. What are these people like? You’re meeting them here in London now, you’re interacting with Team Rose. What is it like? I’m surrounded by a whole group of people that really just want to better themselves, learn themselves better, become more and more self-aware, and it’s not always like that. You mentioned Mike’s buddies last night, and you know, it’s a crab in the bucket mentality.

11:44 One crab can get out, five, none of them can get out, because they just keep pulling it back in. And you’ve got to listen and get away from those peer groups that, you know, they just want you to stay like them. So whenever I have an opportunity to be around you and the people in my group, these are all, we are all, have a like-mindedness. We’re all self-educated.

12:07 It doesn’t matter, MIT, right? Yeah. So it doesn’t matter if you’ve got an MIT degree, you didn’t stop learning, right? There’s probably people that are graduated, that’s, okay, that’s it, I’ve got a job, I got a great job or whatever. Maybe not MIT, because it is a little bit up there, a little ways. But these are like-minded people for me, and I think that’s a rarity in society these days.

12:35 It doesn’t matter what country you live in. And many people, it’s not to blame or to be elitist about it, by no means, some people are just struggling to get through life. I know that I certainly did three or four years ago. So, but it’s just fun to be around like-minded people at the same time, but you can just talk about anything. Yeah.

12:53 What was your biggest win on the course? The biggest thing you were proud of, or the breakthrough, your head, or something you’d be like, okay, yeah, I did this? I think it was the webinar that was totally unrelated. So I was doing a webinar on security, and some of the tools and techniques that I picked up just knocked it out of the park, even learning from the webinars that you do. And just, I got done with it, I hit 60 minutes on the nose.

13:20 I have no interaction, right, which is tough, if you’re by yourself, you don’t have anybody with him report. You’ve got to really do it. I had a semi-script, but I, you know, I added to it and ad-libbed quite a bit during it, but I knew the subject so well, it was very good. And so I went through with the passion, right, and the passion, the clarity. And when it was all over with, I looked at that, it was started at 10 a.m. Central.

13:44 When it was all over with and I’m signing off on the webinar, I look and it’s exactly 11:00 a.m. So I did it exactly at 60 minutes without even trying, and then I knew that I nailed it. I mean, it was really good, and that really felt good. So I think the aha for the course, those is really the principles and the systems and the processes you put in place.

14:10 So it can be overwhelming, but if you stick to it, it really compresses your learning curve down. It’s something that if you try to learn all these things on your own, yeah, you can do it, right? But where are you going to be, a year Eddy on the road? Why not compress that down to, what is it, eight weeks, seven weeks? Why not compress that down to eight weeks, and you’re already ahead. You’re not burning another ten months trying to master, or at least get acquainted with, a certain element, whether it’s technical, whether it’s interview techniques.

14:41 You’ve got to compress that, because time is the most valuable thing we have. And if you’re really, if you really want to be dedicated to it and really become a really good broadcaster, you’ve got to compress time wherever you can, especially with the wealth of knowledge out there, you know, on the internet and everything else. I mean, it’s all there.

14:59 You know, what is your kind of broadcasting future look like in 12 months? Because I don’t know where you’re gonna go to. I don’t know how you gonna implement it, or podcasting or webinars or whatever, but what does this look like one year? Well, I’m definitely doing webinars, absolutely doing that. I really enjoy them. The podcasting thing, I honestly don’t know. I have so many things that I want, I want to work on the foundation, which I’ve kind of neglected the last couple of months.

15:26 But I’ve established a foundation that’s encouraging critical thinking skills in young adults. So one of the first things that we’re doing is awarding book scholarships. So you read from a list of books, and these are books that you’re not going to get, certainly not in US public schools, but even in private schools. So I’m involved with the Montessori School where I live, and they have a different education technique.

15:52 But even there you’re not going to, you know, getting to these old world first principles thoughts and critical thinking skills and reason and logic, and I think that’s sorely missing in all forms of education. And if you have those as a young adult, it makes learning everything else so much easier. I really have a passion for that. And so I think there’s gonna be some leverage along those lines, educating young adults.

16:16 Hey, maybe have a series of shows about just logic. What’s the basis of logic? Where did the logic come from two or three thousand years ago? Yeah, no, Plato, let’s talk about those. Because that, if you understand the first principles of how humans came up with these thoughts, we’re not reinventing, we’re not coming up with those now. These have been thought for thousands and thousands of years and it really hasn’t changed. And so First Principles is often inside of philosophy, and that’s what you’re gonna do. I love it.

16:49 Yeah. How was Tom different? If we walked out on the street right now, I bumped into Tom that didn’t take this course, how’s that guy different than you? I’m more of a just do it guy now. Just more let’s get it done. You buy the ticket, you take the ride. So when I’m talking to my IT team, I said, okay guys, here’s what we’re doing. In the past I would gather up a consensus. I would make sure that everybody understood: here’s the destination, you agree with that? If you don’t, let’s talk that through so I can convince you.

17:19 And now it’s, okay, I’m certain this is the right path. If you bought the ticket, you’re taking the ride, or you’re gonna get left behind. So if you miss out on the accountability doc, we’re not circling back. Catch up or get off the roller coaster. If you bought the ticket, you’re taking the ride. And so that’s really the biggest thing that I got out of it. You didn’t wait.

17:42 I was called out as a clown one week, so I went out worst to first. I don’t know if you noticed, but I went worst to first in like a week or two. I think it was a week, actually. Yeah. And because I knew that you’re not circling back for me, there is child left behind, right? So, okay, got to get caught up, I’m gonna be serious about this. Yeah, nice.

18:02 Look, that’s what I want people to learn. Pull the trigger, start before you’re ready. Be ready with, it’s not perfection. If it is perfection, you just got left behind from someone else who pulled the trigger. So that’s what it’s always about. I think even Pena says, I says, I’m sometimes in error but never in doubt, and that’s what we need from leaders. That’s, and it’s confident, it’s absolute confidence, and just going ahead and making a decision and accept the fact that it may be wrong.

18:26 But if all indication is that it’s a sound decision, but don’t make, don’t make decisions based on ego because you think you’re smart. If you base a decision upon all the available information, and it needs to be a timely decision, just make the decision and live with consequences. And if you based it properly on the right principles and the right logic, then chances are you’re gonna be right more often.

18:48 Along to someone who’s thinking about taking this course but they’re on the fence, what would you tell them? Just do it. If you’re really thinking about doing a podcast and you really think that’s something that really interests you, I can’t think of a quicker way to get up and running and really doing it right, ’cause you’re covering all the bases. And yeah, you, the way, you’d be a master at it at eight weeks? Oh hell no, hell no.

19:23 But you’ve got the foundation laid, you’ve got those first principles laid, and it’s something, oh yeah, it may be two years later and all of a sudden go, oh wait, wait, I know, I remember that now, I work that in, and otherwise you wouldn’t have that. So just do it. You know, what you got to lose? And make sure you understand your time is valuable.

19:45 You know, money buys time, and that’s the, money is not an end of itself, it’s time, as the most… You know, Seneca said that we’re given copious amounts of time. Time is an abundant for human life, but we fritter it away, and often that’s on resistance or other things that are not productive. And so it seems as you start, and when you hit a moment of mortality in your life, and all of us do, all of a sudden time becomes even more valuable.

20:17 But if we understood that when we’re 12 or 24 or 36, yeah, I’m healthy, I’m fine, everything’s gonna work out, I’m gonna live forever, you’re still frittering away time, and everybody dies, and that’s it. Nobody escaped, as far as I know. It’s funny how as humans we can try to save a few dollars here, save a few dollars there, and then waste two weeks or two years trying to learn something or do something or spend time with people with bad energy.

20:45 And yet we don’t try to claim that thousand dollars back. And so we make these decisions every day, right? Well, I’m not gonna drive there, that’s a 22-hour drive, I’m gonna buy an airplane ticket and get there quicker. So you’re making that decision, you’re buying time by buying an airplane ticket rather than taking the train or driving. And so this is the same principle, right?

21:09 You’re buying, you’re in the grocery store and you buy the strawberries that are already chopped or sliced or whatever, you’re buying time right there. Now, I personally happen to don’t mind slicing strawberries and all that, so I get it fresh and do it that way. But convenience time is what, it’s actually the best use of money I can think of, to me. And if you don’t think that way, maybe you have to come at it from a different angle.

21:34 But for me, it’s all about coming back: I’ve got to learn this, master it in a shortest period of time as possible. It’s similar to what Tim Ferriss does. How do I take the wealth of human knowledge and learn what this guy does? Similar to what you do. You do this. How do I take that knowledge and leverage it to increase my understanding, to get there quicker and faster, so I don’t have to put the 10,000 hours in, right? Yeah, for mastery.

21:58 Tom, has been amazing having you on this course. I can see you’re like reinvigorated with this energy and this group, and you got new ideas flowing through your head, so I love seeing this. Welcome to the family. You can be part of London Real for a long time. You got this peer group, you got me here. So really looking forward to what you’re doing to do in all of your broadcasting ways, whether it’s webinars or podcast or working with kids, and there’s been a real pleasure having you on this course.

22:23 Well, thank you very much. I look forward to continuing to follow your endeavors. It sounds like you’d have the same passion that you did several years ago, maybe more. Maybe more at this way, be more at London Real. We say it’s about the journey. I wish you’re willing. There’s Tom. Thanks so much. Oh, thank you, it’s been a pleasure. Cool.