Tom Rhodes - The International

Full transcript: Tom Rhodes on London Real

7:52 Brian Rose: This is London Real. I am Brian Rose. We are sponsored today by the folks at Bulletproof Coffee. We’re actually drinking it as well. It’s a coffee that’s free of molds and toxins.

7:59 You stick some grass-fed butter in there, some MCT oil, and boom, I get a smile on Tom’s face.

8:04 Tom Rhodes: It’s kind of a good replacement for breakfast in the morning. It’s delicious and creamy.

8:08 Brian Rose: I know, and you said black, and then I was like, uh-oh, and you drank it, so you’re feeling it. It’s fantastic.

8:13 Tom Rhodes: I like really strong black coffee. All right, yeah, it’s good. It’s a nice change in the morning as opposed to eating like a buttered croissant or a sugar cereal, that kind of thing. So yeah, it should serve us well. It’s delicious.

8:25 Brian Rose: So thanks to those guys. If you want to check out their blog, their whole biohacking company, it said. They have a blog? Yes, they have a blog. About each cup they drink?

8:34 These are people who are serious about their coffee. They are. That’s quality. And about hacking, sleep hacking. So it goes on and on.

8:42 But it’s bulletproofexec.com. I’m actually doing a bunch of sleep hacking videos with them. Can you only buy it online? I think so. I think they’re trying to get into a few retail stores, maybe in West Coast, but right now it’s online.

8:53 But it’s all good. So thanks to those guys. I might go volunteer at the factory. Maybe you should. So much I like it.

8:59 I think it might be in like Central America. Well, that’s- It’s good for you, right? Hey, I’m in. You travel, you travel. In case you’re wondering who this guy is, is Mr. Tom Rhodes, who is an American comedian.

9:10 You’re an actor, you’re a travel writer. I think you might have been discovered by Jay Leno back in the day, I’m not sure, but you were also, I think, the very first spokesperson for Comedy Central in the 90s. You have a podcast, which is Tom Rhodes Radio. You feature comedians, people around the world. Kim.com, you interviewed in New Zealand before 60 Minutes did.

9:30 I will listen to that right when I get off of this. You travel around the world. You write for Huffington Post. You’re here in England to school us in the art of comedy. You’re at the Soho Theater this weekend for three nights.

9:45 It’s really exciting. Tom, welcome to London Real.

9:48 Tom Rhodes: Thank you, my brother. It’s good to be here. The Jay Leno didn’t discover me.

9:53 It’s just a cute little story that happened. I knew I wanted to be a comedian since I was 12. I grew up in Orlando, Florida. And Jay Leno used to be a very dangerous, political, edgy comedian, believe it or not. before he became Mr. Doritos Shill and the late night talk show guy with an airplane hanger full of automobiles.

10:15 Brian Rose: Yeah, he’s retiring, isn’t he?

10:17 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, he’s had a good run. There was a place in Orlando, in Winter Park actually, a jazz club, and they would do big name comedians. And Jay Leno was playing and I think I was like 16. And I couldn’t get in, wasn’t old enough.

10:35 A friend of mine and I went and stood by the exit door. And the opening act came out, we stuck our foot in the door, and we got to go in. And right where the exit door was is where the dressing room was. And then just two feet in front of the exit door was the stage entrance curtain. And we watched him perform through the crack in the curtains.

10:58 And we could actually see between his legs and see the audience. It was a perfect vantage point. So he finishes the show, he comes off, hey kids, what are you doing back here? And, sorry Mr. Leno, I wanna be a comedian, and would you mind, we asked him for advice.

11:15 Brian Rose: Had you done any stand-up at the time?

11:17 Tom Rhodes: Not at that point, I started when I was 17. Okay, all right. So he had a garbage can full of beer and ice, and he actually let us have some beers. We were underage, so asking him questions, and he said that anybody that wants to be a comedian needs to live in New York or London.

11:32 And when I was 20, I moved to New York.

11:35 Brian Rose: And New York or Los Angeles?

11:37 Tom Rhodes: Los Angeles, yeah. And I moved to New York City, and it was the worst year of my life. So I just wasn’t ready yet as a comedian.

11:46 Couldn’t get on at the good clubs. It’s a tough city to live in when you’re young. Especially when you’re 20 and you don’t have any money. I could only afford to live in Washington Heights, above Harlem. But years later, when I had a sitcom on NBC, I got to be a guest on his show, and I mentioned that to him.

12:02 Brian Rose: Did he remember?

12:03 Tom Rhodes: He said he did, but of course he didn’t, you know, television. Oh, yeah, I remember. I just saw the 60 Minutes on Jay and because he’s leaving and they’re interviewing him and and I watch what he does. And it was interesting.

12:15 He says he like he tries to have comedy that appeals to everyone in the nation. And when you do that, it’s always going to be kind of bland. But, you know, I can’t watch the show. But, you know, maybe that’s the reason he’s retiring is because he’s been unwatchable for many years now. Yeah, I probably agree. Yeah. Yeah.

12:31 Brian Rose: So yeah, so I always love that Bill Hicks a bit about him committing suicide and he blows his brains out on air and then the The NBC peacock forms on the wall perfectly and the his brains and his blood Bill we miss you. Yeah, you were an influenced by Bill to a certain extent

12:48 Tom Rhodes: a huge influence Um, I met him. I knew him. I wouldn’t say we were friends. He loved it over here. He loved it Well, that’s the thing like he I met him in Orlando when he was I was just starting out and he played nobody knew who he Was and then when I lived in New York that very terrible year when I was 20 He was the man he was starting to do David Letterman’s and stuff and he was always nice to me and a lot of the New York comedians were kind of snooty arrogant pricks and Kind of a clique and Bill would walk in and come straight to me. Hey Tom, how’s it going?

13:23 You know always really nice to me sweetheart and then I moved to San Francisco when I was 21 and that’s where things really started to Come together for me as a comedian and then I saw him out there and you know, and he was like, wow, I just And still in San Francisco where you think he would have been absolutely adored The place was only half full the punchline, which is you know, one of the holy temples of stand-up comedy in America and He was like, yeah, I just you know played a to 15th century church in Ireland, to 300 people standing room only and killed it. He was being absolutely adored over here and people in the States weren’t that into it yet.

14:03 Brian Rose: Do you think they loved him after the fact?

14:06 Like everyone talks about him now.

14:08 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, now after the fact, sure. But at the time he was much bigger. I think it was a source of frustration for him.

14:14 Brian Rose: But I mean, how lucky was he?

14:15 He was adored over here and the guy who was of superior intelligence. I mean he died at 34. I mean imagine if he’d have, I mean he had that much intelligence insight and wisdom and like a real bullshit radar on you know the government and war and you know all these things that were happening. I mean it’s great that he you know he found a place where people appreciated his voice. Do they love him over here because it was a pretty intelligent comedy and it was really observational and very nuanced like

14:46 Tom Rhodes: yeah I mean I’m surprised that England didn’t spall in a lot of comedians that had kind of that style after him as in British comedians yeah because he made such a big splash over here

14:58 Brian Rose: how will you change your show up like I know you’re constantly traveling and I want to get into that because you don’t technically have a home but like when you come to Britain do you alter your comedy a bit will you warm up at different places as opposed to say an American audience are they I don’t know I think Rogan once said they’re they’re smarter here but I mean that’s a pretty general thing to say about London audience how is it different

15:25 Tom Rhodes: I mean for me it changes everywhere I go I mean I’m this is the end of my little European tour not little it’s been fantastic Barcelona you I did two week a two-week tour of Holland and which you live there before I lived in Amsterdam for five years I had a late-night talk show and Dutch

15:43 Television for two years. That’s crazy. And that was a, you know, storybook experience. It’s remarkable that it happened to me and that I had this story in Holland. But did any other Americans have late night talk shows for two years in another country where English is not the language? I don’t think it’s ever been done. Yeah, I think I’ve got to be, I think probably the first time. I’m not sure maybe in Sweden or something. It’s happened.

16:10 Brian Rose: Wikipedia page reads like Forrest Gump in a weird way.

16:13 Tom Rhodes: Why do you say that?

16:15 Brian Rose: Because like I don’t it’s it’s hard to figure out what you are like a lot of our guests here is the same way like they’re not one thing so you’re not really just a comedian anymore you’re not just a TV star you’re not just a travel guy you’re not this you’re so many different things I mean like you’ve moved to Nederland for five years you do a talk show for two years as an American there I mean that there’s a lot of just really strange stuff cool stuff

16:43 Tom Rhodes: yeah strange and cool I mean you know I grew up in a little town outside of Orlando, Florida called Ovido and you know I you know I don’t know I think I always wanted to be European okay and I wanted to wear scarves and you know I love walking with an umbrella you know in Florida sunny all the time I mean you know it changes for me in every country I go you have to change it to a certain degree like I played in Holland and then I did shows in Paris and then last weekend I was in Barcelona so I mean you’ve got to change a little bit here and there but that’s the kind of the exciting thing for me to see what you know references you’re gonna lose in each country but what you lose you gain in observations usually I’ve been playing in in London for a long time I had to take a break for a while. But London was the key to everything for me. I had done, everywhere in the United States, I had built up a really nice, respected name for myself, doing the Comedy Central

17:44 Stuff for years. I did the special Viva Vietnam, where I went to Vietnam.

17:49 Brian Rose: It was in 95, right?

17:50 Tom Rhodes: Yeah. And it was in the 20th anniversary of the war ending. My father was a helicopter pilot. He got shot down. Everyone died except for him and one other guy.

18:00 Brian Rose: When you told him you were going to go film that special, what did he say?

18:04 Tom Rhodes: He wanted to go. Okay. Because this was- He wanted to go. My dad- Because nobody had been going back then.

18:09 No, no. It was only like American veterans. Right. And McCain even gone back. Who had gone to like get in touch with, to like forgive their past or something.

18:17 It wasn’t, it had, Bill Clinton had just made it open for Americans to travel there. Okay. September 94 and that’s when we went and filmed it and then it aired in 95. And that was all because they had given me the first development deal in the network’s history. And it culminated in that special, because they had me doing everything.

18:39 It was like being a junior filmmaker. They filmed all these jokes of mine, like rock videos. That’s where I first came on Comedy Central, and that’s where I really made a name for myself. And they were cool. They were in a jail cell in New York City, the first ones, and then they had me doing everything.

18:59 Would cover the Super Bowl, the Dream Team. I went on tour with the Horde Festival, which was like the Black Crows, Cheryl Crow, Ziggy Marley, and Comedy Central hired a tour bus for me, and I’m in this caravan with all these rock band things, and we went all over the country. We did like 10 dates, filmed this tour. I got to do so many cool things. I should say that I smoked some pot with Ziggy Marley, And for being Bob Marley’s son, he should be embarrassed at the low level of quality weed that he pulled out.

19:35 But maybe, you know, that’s what he pulled out for the white American guys that came on his bus. But anyway, so that all led to Viva Vietnam. And then-

19:43 Brian Rose: And Comedy Central was just an idea at that point. They just thought-

19:46 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, we’re just starting out. It was like their first year or their second year.

19:50 Brian Rose: And you were like- It sounds like you were like-

19:53 Tom Rhodes: They didn’t have any signature shows yet.

19:55 Brian Rose: Okay, you were like news anchor slash in the field guys.

19:58 Tom Rhodes: I was their spokes boy. I was skinny and sexy and had long hair and I had a lot of attitude. Okay, so then I did this sitcom on NBC and then that only lasted for a year and it was very frustrating and I moved back to New York City because I always swore if I ever had any money I would live in New York City with style.

20:16 I got a rock star apartment in the Wall Street area and it was insane. I was doing a lot of partying but at that same time I started investing in trips over to London and doing free sets. It’s the same way I got in with San Francisco coming from the East Coast. I had to invest in myself like three or four trips over, sleep on friends’ couches, do free guest sets. There’s no mystery how you get in with places.

20:43 People are like, how do you get in with California or Europe? You go there.

20:47 Brian Rose: So what, you build a small audience by doing the doing sets or you get in with the clubs?

20:52 Tom Rhodes: No, no, no, no. You go to clubs.

20:54 You go to clubs and you do free guest sets. at your own expense. And Rich Hall was a good friend of mine who was doing very well for himself here, and Greg Proops, and they both told me they thought I would do really well here. And so Rich Hall kind of guided me. He told me, you don’t want to go to the comedy store first.

21:14 That’s the best club in Europe. You want to do peripheral gigs. Get your sea legs, you know. So I did like gigs around London, you know, did try, what worked? You got to find out what works.

21:26 What doesn’t work, you don’t wanna go, it’s the same thing like in LA or New York or San Francisco, Chicago, the big cities in America. If you’re a young comedian, you don’t wanna go to the best clubs too soon. Because when they see you, that’s how they’ll remember you forever. It’ll take a long time for you to get that image out of their head. So by the time I did go to the comedy store, I was used to playing in London and the whole point of this very long story was that London was the key to everything for me.

21:57 The fact that I got in with London and the Comedy Store specifically is what led to all these gigs around Europe. All these fantastic worldwide circuits are booked out of London. Asia Tours, Australia. I had no idea. And so London for me has always been crucial in that I think if you’re a powerful comedian you should be able to play here and rock the fucking balls off the joint.

22:26 Brian Rose: Right, but a lot of American comics don’t come here. I think they’re too afraid. They miss it.

22:31 Tom Rhodes: I think they’re too afraid. I think you get into a certain comfort zone.

22:34 You play in different regions. I mean, some people are afraid to play in New York. Okay. Or Chicago. Because audience is tricky.

22:41 Because some of them can be tough. Okay. And I’ve been a comedian so long, I enjoy a little chaos. Okay. And I did a little guest set last night.

22:52 I got heckled before I even got started. What is the London? And it was these guys, and these were some hard dudes. I talked to them after the show. And they were like, it’s always the quintessential heckler always after the show says, I was helping your show, right?

23:07 I made it better. And these guys were saying it, but these were like, oh my God, these were like real cockneyed tough guys like Ben Kingsley and Sexy Beast. So older, older, but not that old. But I’m talking to the guy for a minute who’s telling me the proper way to shoot somebody. All these kids now, they want to shoot like this.

23:30 I was taught, you roll your shoulders, and then boom, boom, two in the bird’s nest. That’s Cockney for chest. You get it, American? And he’s just telling me, and I’m talking to this guy, and I’m like, man, this guy is probably really wounded some people in his life.

23:42 Brian Rose: Yeah, you don’t see Brits talking about guns.

23:44 Tom Rhodes: But they were like drunk. We don’t have guns, usually. So you don’t hear many guys talk about guns. Right, right, right, right. Maybe they did know it.

23:50 But it was like, as a comedian, getting heckled right off the bat, okay, motherfucker, I’m not going to capitulate. When I was a young comedian, I would. And you get your little fragile house of cards collapsed by some punk yelling shit at you and stealing your thunder at a show, you were going to go home and write as many evil comeback lines as you possibly can. I’ve got tons of- Tons of comeback line. I got something for everybody. Okay. I got comeback lines for old people women So it’s like, you know, you know when I step on stage everyone loses title and rank I’m the fucking sheriff and I know every I you know, I I know everything that’s going on You know, I could see the waitresses and people picking their nose if somebody’s pulling their phone out And if somebody’s gonna yell something, you know, it’s the sheriff’s job to uh,

24:46 Brian Rose: what do you do?

24:47 Do you school them right away? Is it important crush them immediately?

24:51 Tom Rhodes: I’ve got to prove your don’t know what all comedians do cuz no No, no, but if If you’ve been a comedian for a very long time, you should have that ability

24:59 Brian Rose: Okay, so school them right away get them to just let them know who’s in charge Okay, is it

25:04 Tom Rhodes: and then you know, the guy knew the guy thought he was whoo-hoo-hoo You’re kind of sexy. He said to me something like that like trying to be cute, you know

25:12 Brian Rose: And does it help your act at all? Does it amp you up a little bit?

25:16 Do you find sometimes you do have better sets when you get a little heckling in the beginning?

25:20 Tom Rhodes: Sometimes, but if somebody heckles you before you get the first joke out, then it’s the audience doesn’t know who you are. Okay. So I couldn’t win them over. Okay.

25:27 I mean, I did win them over, but I mean, it took a few more jokes to get there. Because if you start being a dick right away. When you’ve already won the audience over and they like you, then you can do anything. And you can crush. Yeah, and then if somebody heckles you and you crush them, and then it’s standing ovation practically.

25:44 Brian Rose: Okay, in general, what’s the London audience like? Like, what are they like, what don’t they like? I mean, is there certain comedians that would have no chance over here?

25:52 Tom Rhodes: I wouldn’t ever say any audience is like anything. My favorite audiences are multi-ethnic and multi-national and very well-informed.

25:59 So for me, playing in London is like playing New York, Chicago, San Francisco, Sydney, Paris is like that on a small level. Where, you know, the audience can be people from anywhere. You know, you got, it’s not necessarily all British people. It’s, you know, you get Swedish people, Italians, French, you know. Yeah.

26:23 But I think, you know, English people sometimes will heckle you not because they think you’re a douche bag, but they’re heckling you just to see what you’re made of. Okay. And so I think as foreign comedians coming here, you should remember that. Yeah, even if you don’t have a lot of comeback lines just don’t fucking collapse Don’t look afraid. I mean and you shouldn’t be afraid if you’re on stage and you got you know It you know like it was like I was saying about getting your sea legs. You know you should You know there comes a point if you’ve been doing it over ten years at least I mean you should be kind of fearless when I lived in San Francisco I loved there was a gay club and then across the Bay in Oakland. There was an all-black club and And then sometimes there were all Latino shows.

27:12 And I loved, you know, being able to crush in front of an all black audience and all gay audience. I mean, it’s, you should, you know.

27:19 Brian Rose: I’ve heard comedians say that like all black audiences are tough, or all Latino audience is tough.

27:25 Tom Rhodes: All black audiences are the best. Okay.

27:27 Tom Rhodes: They’re the best. Best, are they, you’re the best when it goes well, it’s the best. They will jump out of their chair and just dance and if they think something is hilarious.

27:36 Brian Rose: You know, we had Felicia Michaels in here like six months ago and she was talking about how in the beginning of her career, she blew up really early and she was like 19 and like getting all these gigs and it was like the hey days of comedy in like the 90s. She was in Playboy magazine.

27:51 She was in Playboy magazine and she was getting paid like tons of money and then it all kind of like, you know, went really big bubble and then it started getting alt comedy and then all of a sudden these other acts were coming in and she found it hard to be successful and she took some time off and then when she said she came back, she ended up like going to a comedy class, it was like that, she was that low, and so she went back, I know, and did like the, I know, she told me this, and I was like, I know that is like the worst thing a comedian could admit, but I mean, you had amazing success in the 90s with Comedy Central and all that stuff. Like, how do you manage the, like, plateaus and the rises in a career?

28:28 Tom Rhodes: I never considered doing anything else, ever, for a minute.

28:31 It never crossed my mind to leave it. I do think the time I spent in Europe, even though I was going back to the States and doing my favorite clubs, because I didn’t want my American comedy muscle to get flabby. I think some people think I might have wasted my time spending time in Europe, but I think it was the most valuable time in my life, and the greatest period of my life. You know, when I was living in Holland, before I had the late night talk show, I had moved there for a Dutch woman, and there wasn’t a lot of comedy gigs.

29:06 And I was flying back and forth every other weekend to London, it was great. Oh my God, it’s like a 40-minute flight. And they give you a big wad of English pounds at the end of the night when you’re finished, a proper wedge, as they say. And I think my biggest strength as a comedian strength as a comedian is the fact that I’ve been so many places in the world, and my favorite part of the show is when I ask people, you know, what countries, is there people from different countries here, and then it’s really exciting, like to, on the top of my head, to, cause I usually have a story or a joke about different places.

29:49 Brian Rose: Have you played places like Dubai or places like Asia? You played Jakarta or something, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Is, how is that comedy scene?

29:58 Tom Rhodes: should change its name to sleeping pill

30:00 Brian Rose: do they have comedy

30:02 Tom Rhodes: didn’t care for actually the comedy store in London had a they might still have it I did it once never okay wanted to go back there I did the job done Jakarta a lot okay I did Jakarta for the first time two weeks after September 11th and it’s the highest Muslim populated country in the world and they were burning American flags in the streets and saying attack Americans and American businesses and I I was advised not to leave the hotel, real nail biter.

30:30 I went back 10 years later and did the Jakarta International Comedy Festival. And then there was a parade in front of the hotel and I go down with my wife, she’s a photographer, she wanted to take photos. Some Muslim girl with a headscarf comes up and is talking to me and asked me where I’m from and I told her I was American and we’re talking and she said she was in a Beatles club and then her and her friends get together once a week and sing Beatles songs.

30:58 And I’m like, you’re kidding. My favorite Beatles song is We Can Work It Out. So we start singing We Can Work It Out. And so like, it’s amazing that 10 years before I couldn’t leave the hotel and then 10 years later I’m singing Beatles songs with like three Muslim women with head scarves. It was absolutely no problem.

31:14 And I’ve been back several times since that was 2011. And it’s a great place. I’m still friends with that girl on Facebook and got a lot of nice friends there.

31:24 Brian Rose: So you have a global audience, like more than probably a lot of comedians, because you have to hit the pavement to keep this audience.

31:32 Tom Rhodes: Because I’ve been these places numerous times.

31:35 Which is essential as a comedian. This is new. You know what I mean? God, and there’s so many great comedians. You know, a lot of the British comedians do these tours, and there’s a lot of great Canadian comedians, Australian comedians.

31:47 I did the New Zealand Comedy Festival last year. That’s where I got to interview Kim.com. And just, God, there’s just so many, you know, Steve Hughes, I think you should have him on the show. He’s one of my favorite comedians. He’s Australian, lives in England.

32:01 Tom Gleason is a very funny guy from Australia. Just brilliant comedians. And then the comedy world is very small. So like, you know, we talk, we all know each other, you know?

32:10 Brian Rose: Like what the top hundred guys talk to each other?

32:13 Tom Rhodes: Everybody, I mean, you know, you meet people. You know what places pay. You know if somebody’s a douche bag. You know if somebody’s a joke thief, word gets around really easy. But it’s like being in an exclusive club of fighter pilots or something.

32:31 The guys who do the worldwide festivals and do the worldwide circuits, you know, because not everybody can appeal to, you know, a multinational audience in different countries.

32:42 Brian Rose: Do you have, one of the podcasts I listen to, and I wanna talk about your podcast in a second, is Mark Maron’s podcast. and he seems to have some type of a story with every comedian. He seems to have acquired some type of drama with every comedian in the business.

32:58 Tom Rhodes: I think Mark Maron started his podcast so he could apologize to everyone.

33:02 Brian Rose: Okay. That’s my first one. You mean subconsciously he started it? To apologize?

33:07 Tom Rhodes: Because there’s always some story where he was a dick.

33:11 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, always. And he was a real dick to a lot of people.

33:13 Brian Rose: But he must have been since-

33:15 Tom Rhodes: And I was actually one of his friends.

33:16 Brian Rose: You were, okay. But people must have recognized him being super talented or something, because obviously people still cared enough to care about him, because it’s not like you can just be a dick to everybody.

33:25 Tom Rhodes: Well, the story he tells where he started that podcast, he just felt he wasn’t getting work. Right. And he never did the road. It’s now it’s happening to him because his podcast is a podcast. So he never moved the road.

33:35 I think it was kind of an act of desperation. And he had done that Air America radio thing. And he was really good at it. The guy’s a brilliant mind. But he listened to the Louis CK episode, which I think it was a two parter.

33:51 Brian Rose: They had some real problems. I mean, I always thought they were tight.

33:56 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, they had some real best friend issues. Why didn’t you call? And why didn’t it was some serious drama.

34:04 Brian Rose: You’ve always been friends with Mark? Have you known him for a long time?

34:09 Tom Rhodes: Yeah. Yeah, I mean, it’s not always easy, but. It’s funny, because he was a good guy.

34:14 But now he’s really successful, And I guess he’s got more famous friends to hang out with. It’s funny, because he’s got drama with everyone. It’s funny, when somebody is struggling and in a lot of personal pain, they reach out a little more often than they do when things are going good.

34:31 Brian Rose: Is that a Hollywood cycle, or is that just a comedy cycle?

34:34 Tom Rhodes: I don’t know.

34:35 I’m happy for the guy. And I have to say, he did popularize the medium for comedians doing podcasts. So I’m grateful to that guy. You know, and I you know, I love him. I had some funny Weird stories with him. He was a sweaty little drug addict in San Francisco When we were buddies we talked about it when I was on there when his on his show And then it’s remarkable that he’s he’s been clean for I don’t know 15 years Yeah, it’s like 11 or 12 years. Maybe yeah, and he was the last guy in the world. I thought would get clean Okay. Yeah that and then so I mean that alone I think is respectable and you know like Bill Hicks did his best work after he got clean and you know like I said you know he was really damaging his career because he would be a dick to people.

35:32 Brian Rose: Why do great comedians and drugs seem to go hand in hand?

35:36 Tom Rhodes: It’s fun. Okay. Drugs are fun. Drugs are fun. And then you know you do drugs with your comedian friends oh my god I mean like the times I’ve done mushrooms with Doug stand up I wouldn’t trade that for anything in the world just you know hanging on to the earth hoping not I’m not gonna fall off and go spin out into the stars you know I was good friends of Mitch Edberg we had a lot of late night evenings so it’s great fun it’s good fun

36:02 Brian Rose: I mean there just seems to be maybe more so on comedy or maybe I’m not I’m wrong but there always seems to be you know major of drug issues, prior, kinescent, everyone seems to be, maybe that’s just a fame thing.

36:15 Yeah, I don’t know. I think it was prior, somebody talking about prior said that, you know, the thrill of being on stage and you don’t want to come down, or actually I think it was the Belushi Wired book. But that was, what was his name, that journalist that wrote the book, Bob Woodward, I think that was his assessment of Belushi and comedians. But you don’t buy that? I don’t know.

36:39 Tom Rhodes: I mean, I don’t think it’s because you were the thrill of being on stage, I think. Comedians are usually people who are the life of the party. And the life of the party is usually driving the party. You know, let’s have more drinks. Let’s go find another place that’s open if this place is closing.

36:58 And it’s not just drugs. I think the alcohol is the big thing. You know, I’ve recently taken a break on drinking. I blacked out January 1st, and… New Year’s Eve, New Year’s Day.

37:15 New Year’s Day. Okay. Night, and got six stitches on my forehead. Yeah, I was about to say, I was gonna… It’s fresh.

37:23 Brian Rose: Okay, I was like, you know, that’s fresh, and that’s a great story from like 20 years ago. It’s actually, it’s kind of a cool scar. Yeah, if you’re listening, Tom has a mean scar over his right eye.

37:34 Tom Rhodes: I mean, I look like Frankenstein, too, when I had the stitches.

37:37 Brian Rose: How many stitches?

37:38 Tom Rhodes: Six. Looks like 20. Yeah.

37:44 Now I look in the mirror and I think, wow, I kind of look like a badass with this scar on him.

37:49 Brian Rose: I’m sure, though, I’m surprised those guys gave you a hard time with the hecklers, because they were probably like, wow. It looks like a sexy beast scar.

37:56 Tom Rhodes: Maybe they didn’t have good eyesight. I don’t know.

37:59 See, I’m actually taking a little break on the drinking, Which is great because I’m so much more sharp and focused on stage and I’ve got total recall of my jokes, past jokes, stories. I’m enjoying it. And nobody loves to drink more than I do. I’ve been a heavy drinker my whole life. Drinking’s a funny one because people say it’s a drink and especially in England, it’s such a part of the culture.

38:26 Those big, tall, delicious English pints, oh my God. You know, shooting the shit with people all night and drinking during the day when I first came here and worked in finance You know drinking at lunch was a very standard thing to do, you know, it was normal So, you know, but it but it’s a very powerful drug. It’s just that we don’t think of it that way So it’s easy to get involved with it. And then all of a sudden, you know, you got stitches So I think people don’t take it as seriously maybe because it’s not illegal. But uh, you know, it’s right up there I would say yeah, I know, you know, I think I got lucky because I could have lost teeth I could have lost an eye, I could have gotten a concussion but knocked into a coma.

39:06 I kind of looked at it like that. It was only for a second and this guy was lifting me up and there was just so much blood on the floor.

39:13 Brian Rose: It must have been.

39:14 Tom Rhodes: It was a crazy amount of blood comes out of your forehead.

39:17 Brian Rose: Were people freaking out?

39:18 Tom Rhodes: Yeah.

39:18 Brian Rose: And did you get to the hospital right away?

39:20 Tom Rhodes: This guy goes, we got to call an ambulance. I went, fuck that. I don’t have health insurance.

39:25 Don’t you dare call an ambulance. And I go, how far is the hospital? And he goes, two blocks. I go, two blocks, and you were going to call on everyone. So the bartender handed me a wad of napkins, and I walked like John Wayne.

39:38 Brian Rose: Is it the States?

39:39 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, Philadelphia. OK, gotcha. And Philly’s a tough town. So it’s funny that I did this to myself.

39:45 Because Philadelphia’s a town where people get their asses beat, which is what I like about Philadelphia. I mean, it’s a tough town.

39:52 Brian Rose: You live a nomadic lifestyle. You don’t have a permanent residence. Is that right?

39:57 Tom Rhodes: No.

39:57 Brian Rose: So you have things in storage, or you just have enough to travel with and you just go?

40:02 Tom Rhodes: I’ve had everything in storage for, I threw everything into storage when I moved to Amsterdam. And then after I lived in Amsterdam, I moved back to Los Angeles for two years and I got everything out of storage. And then I realized, you know, a lot of what I had was total bullshit, like furniture and shit like that, you know.

40:19 The things I realized that only, the things that meant things to me, I call it my empire of $20 purchases. CDs and books, I mean people don’t even have CDs anymore. But like family photos and things from my career. So when I threw everything into storage the last time, I gave things away to comedians that I knew needed things. One guy needed a TV, take my TV.

40:44 You need a couch, take the couch. You need a coffee table. And so I really condensed it to what was really, You know, my most important archival things. I have a massive book collection that’s very important to me.

40:58 Brian Rose: Were you a guy that had the car or a guy that had the big, the house?

41:03 Brian Rose: I mean, were you kind of a guy that did like material things? I mean, is this a bit of a Zen thing when you get things away?

41:12 Tom Rhodes: No, I mean, I’ve always been pretty, you know, my favorite doors lyric of all time is I’ve never been so broke that I couldn’t leave town. I’m a changeling, see me change. Yeah, no, I’ve never thought anything, I’ve been smoothed about.

41:28 I had a car up until December, I kept my car registered, my father lived in Los Angeles and I kept it because everything I had registered in California and then my father was killed by a drunk driver in 2009, so I had to switch it to Florida, all my mom’s address, car car insurance, car registration, and then I, you know, some old friends that, depending where I was in the States, I would leave the car in California or Florida flying off to different parts of the world, kind of James Bondi existence, and then my niece flipped her car in the rain in December and I gave her my car, so now is the first time I’ve in a car in a while, but no, it’s not out of material.

42:19 Brian Rose: Do you know where you’re gonna be in the next year? Is it all charted out?

42:25 Tom Rhodes: Every good comedian is booked at least six months in advance. Seriously. Yeah.

42:30 Brian Rose: Okay, including you. Wow.

42:32 Okay, okay. Well said. And what kind of places are we talking here? Are you like states, are you doing your European tour? Is it a bunch of places in America or are you like constantly going around the world?

42:45 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, I’ve got, when I leave London, I go to Los Angeles for a week, then Las Vegas for a week, then Phoenix, Dallas, Atlanta, Minneapolis, taking my mom’s birthday off in April.

42:56 Brian Rose: Is this hotels everywhere?

42:58 Tom Rhodes: Hotels everywhere.

42:59 Brian Rose: And paid for by the clubs?

43:01 Tom Rhodes: Paid for by the clubs.

43:02 But when we have time off, my wife is a photographer, she travels with me, and depending where we are in the world, we’ll go rent a place. The last three years in a row, we’ve rented a place in Rome. The first two years we went to Rome, It was like see everything and then we went there last September and it was like we pretended like we lived there Yeah, that’s it’s on that and chilled and restaurants and drank wine all night act like a Roman. That’s like a Roman I’ve finished the Jakarta Comedy Festival a couple years ago. We went to Bali for two weeks after that We went to Key West for a couple weeks last summer just depends where we are in the world that’s the cool thing about not not living anywhere is we can live everywhere and and strategically choose where we want to go spend time so you know anyone else that lives that way there’s a Canadian guy Glenn Wall he’s not living anywhere now

43:54 Brian Rose: okay comedian yeah okay yeah do all the come to a lot of comedians ask you about this and like the quiz you want it they think about doing it

44:02 Tom Rhodes: yeah yeah like I’ve had comedians I worked with a guy in Indianapolis and he was from Indianapolis and he was like man I’m thinking I’m ready I’m thinking I’m thinking about it, I’m ready to go to London.

44:14 Can you help me get in with London? And I was like, you know, before you try and get in with London, you should try and get in with Chicago first. It’s only an hour and a half up the road and you haven’t gotten in with Chicago. I mean, you know, you should try and get in with the big cities in your country before you, I don’t know, but yeah, of course, people always ask me about, I’m also very generous. I’ll give comedians, you know, contact information for everybody.

44:42 I mean, that’s how people did it for me. Okay, you know, not it’s not I’m not withholding any information but but it’s chess not checkers.

44:50 Brian Rose: It’s not like a lifestyle you choose. It’s a lifestyle you’ve earned maybe that might be a good way to say it.

44:57 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, I wouldn’t say that but yeah, I can say it.

45:00 Brian Rose: Yeah, talk to me about the comedian podcast because we’ve seen so many comedians including Marin and let’s go we can go through it Rogan and everyone else we were talking about but every comedian has does it for a different reason has a different spin on it some guys take a commercial some guys do it because they love it some guys do it because they need to talk to people like Marin or maybe me talk to me about Tom Rhodes radio when did it start why did you do it

45:28 Tom Rhodes: I actually started in 2009 I had a problem with my original editor and had to take them all down I think I had like 20 episodes on my and then I had to repost them.

45:38 So I think it actually looks like I started in 2010 because I had to repost the earliest episodes. I do it totally out of a labor of love. I don’t have any commercials. And mine is mostly talking with comedians about comedy. And a lot of my best friends, Doug Stanhope, episode number one is great.

46:02 We talked about this mushroom trip we had in Arizona at his house, I’ve done like three with Doug, two with Steve Hughes, done Brian Regan, Jim Gaffigan, just brilliant comedians. And then some non-comedians. My sister died of breast cancer. I did an episode with her before, I don’t know, about six months before she died unexpectedly. That’s a tearjerker.

46:30 Did one with my brother, who’s a very right-wing Republican guy, complete opposite of me politically. And, you know, he’s funny, man. He doesn’t mind gay bashing or, you know, the occasional racial slur. And he thinks Obama was the worst president ever. So, I mean, it’s great to-

46:49 Brian Rose: Do you find on your podcast you can ask people questions you wouldn’t normally ask them?

46:55 I mean, you seem like a pretty open guy anyways, but like with your sister or your brother, can you ask them things straight out and they have to answer it because they’re on your show?

47:04 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, but they take pleasure in it. I mean, some things you think are taboo. That person’s not thinking that at all. They’re like, fuck yeah, let’s fucking roll up our sleeves and get dirty here.

47:13 Let’s talk about some true grit, you know? I got to do Kim.com in New Zealand.

47:19 Brian Rose: Tell me about that.

47:21 Tom Rhodes: It was incredible. I was doing the festival.

47:24 He’s a guy that I find very interesting. And I knew about his story, the FBI and the New Zealand Army had raided his home the year before, and that was on worldwide news. I was being interviewed on Radio New Zealand, or New Zealand Radio, whatever it’s called, their state run, their government, whatever, I don’t know, I guess like the NPR, BBC of New Zealand. And this woman asked me, what’s the one thing you wanna do in New Zealand while you’re here? And I said, I know it sounds silly, but I’d like to interview Kim.com for my podcast.

47:58 I think he’s demonized in the American media and I think he’s a really interesting character and I don’t think that he’s been properly portrayed and I kind of think he’s a cool guy. He followed me on Twitter a couple hours later, I followed him back, I looked at his profile, there was an email, I’m a firm believer in a well-written email. Okay, me too. And I sent him a very nice respectful email, letting him know where I was coming from.

48:27 Brian Rose: Long email or short?

48:28 Tom Rhodes: Medium. Medium. And you don’t want to be a gushing fan. I get those sometimes. It’s like people get to the point.

48:37 People get to the point, you know? Instead of just, you got to, in everything, you got to know how to edit yourself. So his assistant wrote me back, and I got invited to his mansion. And he’s kind of like a, in the club I was playing at in Auckland, they said he’s a huge comedy fan, that he comes to the club all the time. And from everybody I talked to, very personable guy.

49:03 And he was one of the first people to give money to the Christchurch earthquake victims, when the earthquake happened. He’ll do tours of his mansion periodically, every couple of months where people can pay to have a tour of his mansion and the money goes to local schools. The guy is very generous and does a lot for the local community. I learned a lot from him that, you know, because I thought it was like Napster, you know, like when the song trading thing, he said it wasn’t like that.

49:38 You could not type in a title of a movie and get it. It was just files. I mean, it could have been anything. Right. People were just storing things on your site.

49:45 It was like arresting the post office because someone had done something dubious through the mail, what happened with him. And then he changed all the rules, he complied with all the rules and changed his format to comply with everything that he was being asked to do for his new website. I think the guy manipulated the power of internet tools when this new technology came out. He’s an eccentric, interesting guy and I think that’s, well he says on my podcast that it’s Hollywood that’s persecuting him and specifically the Obama administration because Hollywood money funded his campaign and everything.

50:31 But I don’t know, I think the opinion is kind of changing his favor.

50:35 Brian Rose: Now there was just that a couple months ago that 60 Minutes interview and Vice did a thing on him. We were talking about that earlier.

50:42 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, I mean, 60 minutes to the interview. But I was there first, baby.

50:46 Brian Rose: You were. I mean, that’s awesome.

50:48 Tom Rhodes: I mean, 60 minutes to the interview, but they made him look like a Bond villain, which I think he likes to play that role. He likes that. And the guy is like 7 foot 2.

50:57 Brian Rose: Oh, is he that big?

50:59 Tom Rhodes: He’s like, some people go, oh, he’s kind of a fat guy. Uh-uh. No, he’s enormous. He needs a little girth to fucking his, just his frame.

51:09 He’s like German and Finnish. And he’s got a really great spirit, and he’s got a really great sense of humor. And I think he’s, I mean, you were in like the, what do you call it, the money world with trading. I mean, you know, there’s certain guru people that kind of, I’m sure you’re probably one of them. They can sense trends and know how to, that guy, he knows what’s happening with the internet world.

51:39 And I think he’s a very intelligent guy that I think government should probably be working with him to maximize the use of the internet instead of persecuting.

51:50 Brian Rose: Yeah, you look at that raid on his house. It just looked ridiculous. Ridiculous. And they flew helicopters in.

51:57 The guy’s got a wife and a kid, and you know.

51:59 Tom Rhodes: He also had a secret room upstairs. But you know, that was pretty cool. That’s pretty cool. He had like a double secret room.

52:05 Come on, then you wish every kid dreaming of designing his own home would have a. and his private bodyguard. His secret role.

52:11 Brian Rose: We’ve had a bunch of guys on here talking about copyright fraud. We had a guy from the pirate party, the guy that originated the pirate party in Sweden, which is all about internet freedoms.

52:21 And they don’t even believe that copyright should exist. And they believe that piracy actually helps promote Hollywood. You look at Game of Thrones, it’s the most downloaded, pirated show out there, and that promotes it in a certain way. This is what they say.

52:34 Tom Rhodes: Well, that’s exactly what I’m talking about, people working with him.

52:37 Because I think he’s kind of the guy that would have the ideas. I don’t think, we need copyrights, but I think there’s a way to, you know, kinda umbrella protect people’s intellectual properties. And I think he’s probably the guy that would know how to do that.

52:54 Brian Rose: Yeah, I think you might be right. Do you miss television?

52:58 You know, you were on the Netherlands, you had a very controversial video with Steve O up on YouTube, you know, you were being the talk show guy. Yeah, can you tell us what happened with Steve O? Was he stapling things?

53:10 Tom Rhodes: Steve-O likes to staple things. Steve-O, it was the first Jackass movie came out and he was in, he came on my late night talk show in Amsterdam to promote it.

53:18 And Dutch television, you can do anything. It’s interesting, it’s the exact opposite of the United States censorship laws. In the United States, you can’t show graphic nudity, you can’t say a lot of words, but it’s all about promoting products. Where in Holland, you can show anything, You can say anything, but it’s illegal to promote products. Like I could say I liked beer on television, but I couldn’t say I liked Heineken, because that’s endorsing a product.

53:47 That is their only censorship. You cannot endorse products on your show.

53:51 Brian Rose: Is that still the case?

53:52 Tom Rhodes: That’s still the case. Isn’t that remarkable?

53:54 Brian Rose: Yeah, that is, wow.

53:55 Tom Rhodes: So he comes on. I get shocked sometimes. When he comes out smoking weed, he’s on various substances when he comes out. Is it really cool to smoke weed on TV, man?

54:05 He’s since cleaned up, and apparently he doesn’t remember any of this because he’s playing comedy clubs in the States, right?

54:11 Brian Rose: How’s his comedy? How’s his comedy?

54:13 Tom Rhodes: I don’t know, I haven’t seen it. I heard he stays and takes photos with everyone and signs autographs, which is pretty cool.

54:19 Brian Rose: Do you do that?

54:20 Tom Rhodes: No, but I would. I mean, I’m accessible, I would be happy to stay until, I love meeting people. So he said the one thing that was cut out of the movie that he couldn’t do was this trick where he stapled his balls to his leg And he goes, do you wanna see it? I go, hey, who doesn’t?

54:39 So it actually took about 12 minutes for someone to go find a stapler, but television editing, it’s two seconds. Could someone get a stapler? And then someone runs up with a stapler. He pulls his pants down and he smashes, spreads his nut sack, his scrotum across his thigh, and he stapled in. I’m standing right there.

54:58 Brian Rose: What were you thinking at the time?

54:59 Tom Rhodes: I said, dude, we like you already. You don’t have to do this.

55:02 Brian Rose: Were you thinking this is great television?

55:03 Tom Rhodes: Were you thinking about this on my show?

55:05 I was thinking of a man and the importance of his testicles. That’s what I was not thinking this is good television. But Dutch television, there’s a close-up of it. You can show everything on Dutch television. And it’s stuck.

55:20 The staple went through his nut sack and stuck to his thigh.

55:25 Brian Rose: And Jesus, who would do that? Any blood?

55:28 Tom Rhodes: So I put a little spurt. So I put it up on when the show finished, When I moved back to the States, I put some of my favorite clips from that Amsterdam show on YouTube.

55:40 And that one, I don’t know, I had a good number of hits on that one.

55:44 Brian Rose: And then what, they took it down, you said?

55:47 Tom Rhodes: They took it down and they sent me a very stern warning about nudity.

55:51 Brian Rose: Yeah, YouTube police is that pretty good, I don’t think I’ve seen much, it’s American. Do you miss doing TV in the Netherlands, do you miss having your own show?

56:00 I love making television, I had a travel show on Dutch television, I mean I was a presenter on a travel show, wasn’t my own show after the late night talk show finished in Amsterdam. I had a sitcom on NBC, I did the different stuff for Comedy Central, so I’ve done a lot of different stuff. I have been trying to make a comedy travel show where I want to highlight comedy scenes around the world, check out comedy scenes around the world, and highlight comedians from those different countries.

56:36 And I’m obsessed with making these travel videos for YouTube, I’ve got a lot of them on there.

56:41 Brian Rose: I saw your Cambodia one. It’s great.

56:43 Tom Rhodes: Cambodia’s cool. I got a new one on China that’s about to go up in a couple weeks.

56:47 There’s a really interesting young comedy scene in China right now. I was there a few months ago. But I don’t know, I’ve had a difficult time getting a network to make this show. But it’s the beauty of technology now is you can do everything yourself. So I just haven’t monetized anything.

57:07 I don’t have commercials on my YouTube channel. I don’t have commercials on my podcast. I mean, and that’s primarily because I’m a bad business person. It’s primarily because I don’t like commercials. I mean, I should change that.

57:23 I mean, I make good money as a comedian, so I don’t have to have commercials. Maybe it’ll come to the point where I should probably do that because at the moment, I’m the king of free content. But, you know, man, I love Amy Winehouse, and when Amy Winehouse died, I went on YouTube and I started watching her videos. So, not only do you have a sit-through, a commercial at the beginning of the video, and then it’s skip ad after 10 seconds, Okay, skip ad, but then through the video you got these fucking pop-up.

57:58 And it’s like a video game. It’s okay, click this fucking thing off, click this fucking thing off, and it kills the enjoyment of it. So I hope fans of mine appreciate the fact that I want people to have the little slab of entertainment I’m presenting without some bullshit popping up that they have to click out of.

58:17 Brian Rose: I respect that. I hate it when I know rich people are doing a podcast and they stick the ads in there and I’m like, you’re rich.

58:24 Right, I don’t understand why rich people will do the Kickstarter campaigns. Yeah, that’s weird too. Well, guys who you know is a multi-millionaire and then he wants some money to make a movie? Hey, dude, why don’t you cut yourself a check? You can write it off.

58:36 Tom Rhodes: I know, they can write these things off for tax purposes. See, Kickstarter is tricky because-

58:41 Brian Rose: Why squeeze your fucking fan out of $5?

58:43 Tom Rhodes: Because it’s like a PR campaign at the same time and then once the people put money in, you know they’re gonna invest in you in the long term and maybe buy the ticket for the movie. And so Kickstarter is weird, man. It will mess with your head.

58:56 Brian Rose: Kickstarter seemed like a great thing in the pure way that it was meant to be, to help people who don’t have money, who have a vision of a project, to get it made. I think it’s insulting when very famous rich people wanna do a Kickstarter thing.

59:08 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, I understand what you mean.

59:10 Brian Rose: Television, talking about television, do you still think it’s a medium that’s important? I mean, you’re talking about television shows.

59:17 Brian Rose: You see Louis, Louis has his TV show. Marron now is filming his second season of Marron show, you know, is there is would you like to have a Rhodes show? I mean Jesus you got enough material with all the crazy stuff you do I mean, is that something that you think is important or do you think with new media these days? You can do it your own way.

59:37 Tom Rhodes: I’m putting all my chips on new media, baby. Yeah. Yeah Everyone on TV tells me it’s not dead yet. That’s what they say. I don’t think it’s dead yet But I think it’s going that way. I mean, I think everything is I think the future is like instead of an hour special it’ll be a one-minute special that people watch on their phones.

59:55 Brian Rose: For comedians, right?

59:57 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, you know of course I would love to have another television show. I think that a comedy travel show, me being the Anthony Bourdain of comedy, I think is a brilliant idea.

1:00:07 Brian Rose: Me too, I like it.

1:00:08 Tom Rhodes: Who wouldn’t want to make that show. I haven’t found the network. Lee Camp did a Kickstarter for his moment of clarity TV show and then he keeps the ads off it because Lee hates ads. He just hates the whole concept of having ads. So he ran, he raised, I don’t think it was a lot of money. It was like 40 or 50 grand and that paid for six or eight episodes of his MOC show. So you know and then who knows if that gets picked up. He’s not rich. He’s got a lot to say. I love Lee. Yeah. I did an episode of my podcast with him. I think he’s a genius with a you know a very

1:00:40 Good watchdog on what’s happening politically in the world. That Kickstarter was invented for that guy.

1:00:47 Brian Rose: Right. So you’re not going to do a Kickstarter?

1:00:51 Tom Rhodes: No.

1:00:51 Okay. I mean, no. I think like television, I would like it to happen, but I’m getting older and they like young guys with the right tennis shoes and a cool haircut. I don’t know. TV’s weird.

1:01:06 I don’t know. I mean, I’m enjoying my spot. I mean, look at you, you got this great studio. You got your own podcast, your own channel. You don’t need a network to say, you can do this.

1:01:20 That’s what I love about where technology is in the world today. And I think that’s why I revere Kim.com so much, that guy did it on his own. He made all this fortune and I don’t know, man, it’s like a Rubik’s Cube with this technology. You can find it and win at this thing. Not that it’s a contest, but just to have your own audience.

1:01:47 That’s the beautiful thing about now. To have 100,000 hardcore fans that are going to support you in everything you do and you’re going to entertain them and you’re not going to throw some bullshit in their direction, I think that’s the beauty of right now is that you don’t need television to create and find your own audience and sell your products. And you don’t need the middleman of a network or a production studio taking like the comedy specials I’ve done, you know?

1:02:17 For the amount of years that took me to develop that material, I really was paid peanuts, you know?

1:02:24 Brian Rose: The latest thing comedians are doing is they release the video for like five bucks, but you know, most of that comes to that. You gotta be a Louis C.K. or someone like that, Bill Burr to make a lot of money off of it that way right and now another thing is that you know he popularized or maybe he didn’t that hour of new hour of comedy every year and comedians talk about it sometimes I don’t know this business that well is that something you think about is that something that’s necessary for a comedian

1:03:01 Tom Rhodes: I don’t for me personally coming up it’s to come up with a new hour every year, I think a really solid, hard-hitting hour requires a little more time than that.

1:03:13 You know, I did my first CD in 2001, the next one came out 2006, the one after that came out in 2012. For me, it seems to take a five-year period to come up with a new hour of material. Those guys are in different positions, you know? They got fans that apparently adore everything they do. I’m addicted to making specials.

1:03:35 I love it. I love making live CDs. I’ve made three live CDs, all on iTunes. That, I made myself, produced myself. I get most of the money.

1:03:50 But I did the last one, came out a year ago. So I mean, I really wanna come out, I’m really trying to work hard now to come up with the new hour. I don’t want it to take five years.

1:04:05 It’s why I was put on this earth. I mean, I grew up listening to, my dad had comedy albums and I used to listen to them. And that, to me, that is what a comedian, you should try and make as many live things as you can. But I mean, you look at a band after they’ve died, and their body of work, I love Hendrix. I mean, how many Hendrix recordings have been put out?

1:04:31 50, 60, 80? The guy only made three studio albums, okay? With what was left, maybe we could have squeezed 10 out of that, okay? I’ll buy them all. They could put out fart sounds by Jimi Hendrix, and I would buy it.

1:04:45 I’m the schmuck that buys everything that Jimi Hendrix estate puts out. But a lot of it is just, you know, him tuning up in the rehearsal studio. I didn’t need to drop the 1899 on some of the things that I did, you know, I don’t know.

1:05:04 Brian Rose: What’s it like being good friends with Doug Stanhope and how are your careers similar and how are they different?

1:05:13 Tom Rhodes: It’s one laugh after another, man.

1:05:16 He’s a unique, interesting guy and he’s a lot different than me. He’s, but probably one of the truest, most genuine friends I’ve ever had. Guys, you know, always been there, always been a good friend since I’ve known him. We could go a year without seeing each other. He’s just, he’s a beautiful lunatic and he’s got a, it’s, you know, like Bill Hicks died like 34.

1:05:47 So he’s kind of a young guy, Doug is an older guy who has lofty opinions about the world and governments and everything, I think he’s probably one of the most brilliant stand-up comedians who’s ever lived. He’s fun. The guy, you know, I love hanging out with him. I don’t see him enough. He has a seriously loyal fan base.

1:06:14 People that love Stan Hope, like they love him and want to kill for him. And his audience drinks, so I mean, clubs love him. I mean, you know, I’m sure he gets the door and all that and he makes good money, but what’s never spoken about is those clubs are making a fortune because all his audience are, they’re all heavy drinkers.

1:06:36 Brian Rose: Yeah. I didn’t even think about that part.

1:06:39 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, so I mean, it’s win-win situation for nightclubs. But no, stand up, he’s a good, beautiful man.

1:06:46 Brian Rose: And what’s the current state of comedy right now When you see the young up and coming guys in their 20s and like what’s going on right now, are you happy with what you see? Is everyone part of this ecosystem, the older guys, the younger guys that make comedy the world go around?

1:07:05 Tom Rhodes: Comedy seems to have been hijacked by good looking young suburban guys.

1:07:10 Brian Rose: For television faces.

1:07:12 Tom Rhodes: For television faces. And comedy was not invented for the young and beautiful people who got everything thing they ever wanted out of life. Comedy was invented for the ugly and the damaged and the people with the most interesting stories to tell.

1:07:29 Brian Rose: Okay, this is something that’s believed by a lot of comics.

1:07:33 This guy with his scar on his face talking. Maren says things like this too, he’s like, this is for us, you know, guys that got beat up, guys that got messed up, guys that weren’t part of the cool crowd, this is for us, it’s not for the good looking A-list actor looking types. You feel the same way?

1:07:49 Tom Rhodes: Well, I mean, I was a young, good-looking guy who got a lot of things when I was younger. I think that’s definitely why I was the spokesman of Comedy Central.

1:07:58 So one part of me doesn’t want to pass any judgment, but I think I had some decent jokes. I think you see a lot of guys, I won’t even mention what outlets they’re on, but you see guys who just, they don’t have a half-hour material, and they’re being given half-hour specials. And it’s more cuteness and cutesy observations than it is funny.

1:08:26 Brian Rose: And can you be a comedian these days and just be a stand-up comic? Or does your business have to be multi-tiered with a podcast, with a potential TV deal?

1:08:39 Tom Rhodes: Well, like I was saying about creating your own audience. I mean, that’s what the smart people are doing. I mean, if you want to only be a comedian, You need to put asses in the seats. There’s a lot of these, there’s a lot of young comedians who don’t have a lot of material, but they’re getting on the right television shows, so they’re selling places out. There’s some comedians that have four million hits on a YouTube video, and they’re selling places out because they had a video go viral or something.

1:09:08 It’s almost something you have to do to develop your audience and be on Twitter and have a fan page on Facebook and whatever else is coming. But you definitely need a YouTube channel. That’s one of the most important things. Even if your videos don’t go viral. Because it used to be, when I was a young comedian, I started in 84.

1:09:30 Let’s really date me. 30 years. In the 90s, if you wanted to get in with a new club, You had to film yourself and take a VHS tape, put it in a padded envelope, go stand in line at the post office and mail that to a club that probably wouldn’t even watch it. You know, in the late 80s, early 90s, you’d go to comedy clubs and you’d get paid in the office and you’d go in the office and you’d see like a big stack on the wall of like tapes that haven’t been watched.

1:10:05 Now, it’s like you wanna get in a club, you send somebody an email with a link to a little five minute set or whatever you got. Or people all the time go, oh man, did you see this one guy? This is new guy, he’s really funny. And they whip out their phone, look at this clip. That’s the way the world is today.

1:10:23 So, I mean, a YouTube channel is absolutely crucial.

1:10:27 Brian Rose: And what about Twitter?

1:10:29 Tom Rhodes: You know, my YouTube channel, I mean, I got standup bits, I got interview clips, I got travel videos. I put a lot of effort into it money and editing time and you know filming and

1:10:42 Brian Rose: What about other social media is Twitter important for you? Do you use me?

1:10:47 Do you try material out on Twitter? I know some comedians do

1:10:51 Tom Rhodes: at first I was worried about giving away free jokes. Now. I don’t you know a lot of my I like one liners. It’s great for doing one liners

1:10:59 Brian Rose: You know, do you have to worry about the comedian stealing?

1:11:03 Tom Rhodes: That’s what I was worried about when I first got on Twitter and now you don’t

1:11:10 Brian Rose: Is there still something you have to worry about as a comedian?

1:11:15 Tom Rhodes: Yeah, but you never know. It’s not… I had this brilliant joke, and John Oliver did the thing almost verbatim on The Daily Show. Did John Oliver take the joke from me? No.

1:11:30 He’s never seen me. I didn’t know who I am. One of his fucking writers saw me verbatim. It wasn’t John Oliver. I love John Oliver.

1:11:39 He doesn’t know the fuck I am. One of his writers definitely saw me somewhere and handed in the stuff. So it’s people like that. It’s like cowardly comedians who aren’t working and they’re young and they got jobs on TV shows and they’re comfortable and they’re eating off the little deli tray and they’re getting their little jamba juices every day and they’re really enjoying being a part of a television show but they’re not good writers. So you never know.

1:12:07 Brian Rose: It’s it’s guys sitting in the back stand up has talked about this and I On one of my podcasts that you know, you there’s these guys just go to comedy clubs and they sit in the back in LA New York wherever and they may not take the joke exactly or whatever, but and they’re going in and those how do you? How do you police that? How do you know who’s doing it?

1:12:29 Tom Rhodes: You know, I would love to meet John Oliver so I could ask him It’s one of your writers and to do that joke and I’ll bet you I know the guy I bet he’s someone I probably worked with

1:12:40 Brian Rose: do you scan for cameras in your sets in the crowd?

1:12:43 Brian Rose: And do you tell people to put that down? Do people do that anymore?

1:12:47 Tom Rhodes: No, not too much I mean here about Dave Chappelle having a problem with it and stand up and stand up You know, he’s makes a great point. I mean that’s the well in Chappelle as well You know, you’re in a club you’re working things out so that one day you can film it for a special You know when you’re in the clubs, you are you’re developing stuff. You’re polishing it. You’re honing it Getting it down to an economy of words if somebody’s sitting there, you know with their iPhone It’s not gonna be a good shot number one And you don’t know if they’re getting the whole joke and then it might not even be a joke. That’s in its best final form So yeah, you know, I mean most clubs now don’t allow it. So you got Bouncers and door people that swoop in like Eagles And how do you create your stuff?

1:13:32 Brian Rose: Are you a guy that sits down and like, I’m gonna write comedy today, do you write your stuff down?

1:13:38 Tom Rhodes: I write my stuff down, I always have a little notebook that I travel with, a little mama, a little portable book that I carry with me and then I have a mama book that I take things back to and write it. My best material comes from having intelligent conversations with friends or interesting people. It’s always shooting the shit with people. That’s why I love meeting people after shows and talking.

1:14:00 Because they’ll have some crazy point of view or bring up something. These people are interesting. Oh my God, last night I was in Camden Town and just, oh fuck, I met so many cool, crazy, interesting people. I mean, these people, Peru is one of, probably the greatest trip I ever took, one of my favorite places. And I, there was two people at the show that had been to Peru, and this young comedian friend of mine.

1:14:24 And we’re just all talking about Peru and our favorite places. I didn’t get any jokes out of it. But, I mean, it played with my clit, shall we say, to speak about something that I’m really interested in. And I respected these people for going there. And they climbed the Andes, they, you know, we were comparing notes on best things to do in Peru.

1:14:47 And, you know, and we’re standing in London in the rain.

1:14:50 Brian Rose: You must have an advantage to so many guys because you travel so much. I mean, if you’re just living in LA and you go to the local clubs and then you fly to Chicago or New York, you know, once a month I mean isn’t that limit a bit in your new ideas and your flow as opposed to if you’re bouncing around these international locations.

1:15:07 Tom Rhodes: Yeah because I mean as a comedian you know you have your your personal experiences to draw from you know I’ve started doing a lot of stories in the last year and things that took me a long time to talk about it took me many years before I like things I was just too embarrassed that it happened to me.

1:15:23 Brian Rose: You wouldn’t think a a comedian would be embarrassed about that stuff.

1:15:27 Brian Rose: You would think that would be your best material.

1:15:30 Tom Rhodes: Yeah. But I’m an outsider. But it’s interesting, talking to people after the shows, like I know I got one-liners and jokes that get bigger laughs than some of the stories, but I’ll talk to people after the show, and the thing that they remember the most that sticks with them are the stories. And people that write me, oh man, that story you told about that breakup or this thing that happened to you, I mean, you know, I got maced in Paris The first time I went there, you know, I almost drowned in Thailand, diving.

1:16:02 There’s a lot of interesting things that just, the real stories seem to penetrate people the most.

1:16:08 Brian Rose: Some comedians are making a shift to like stories. Some guys will do a story night.

1:16:14 Tom Rhodes: I think, and I think it’s the reason my podcasts are so popular right now. I think that there is a worldwide trend where people crave and desire authenticity.

1:16:24 And I think that explains the entire podcast craze and kinda what’s happening in comedy now because for so many years, we have been fed so much bullshit by our governments, entertainment, everything. Just saccharin-laced, candy-ass bullshit. And I think people really seek out authenticity now. And I think that is probably generated by the internet. Everything is so easily accessible with videos and podcasts that you can really choose your entertainment now.

1:17:07 And I think that that’s my theory, that people are seeking out authenticity. I think it changed. You know, I’ve seen a half dozen episodes of your show,

1:17:23 And your program totally exudes authenticity. I mean, what we’re doing right here. I mean, there’s nobody fucking ringing bells. It’s hard to fake a continuous stream podcast for an hour, hour and a half, over and over again.

1:17:34 Brian Rose: But I mean, it must be your own art is changing a bit, because if people come to your show and they’ve seen your podcast, Like they’re coming because they like Tom Rhodes, they know a lot about you, and so now all of a sudden you’re not performing to a cold audience, you’re performing to this audience that knows all these little things about you, and like that doesn’t, that changes the whole game.

1:17:54 Tom Rhodes: I think that’s cool, and it’s not like, and people really know you, and you know, people know that my sister died of cancer, and that she died, I got married at her hospital bedside the day before she died, and my father being killed by a drunk driver and just things that have happened in my life, I mean, people that listen to your podcasts really know the ins and outs of your victories and your failures and things that you talk about because in a long form conversation like this, a lot of truth comes out, you can’t help it. You can’t fake being a phony bastard for a long extended period of time. So like we were talking about, when I was in London last year, man, that was like one of the first times I, all the, the audience was predominantly people that listened to my podcast who had heard me on other podcasts.

1:18:50 And like they, you know, and then it’s so, the people are more real. They’re genuine fans. They love you with your scars and all.

1:19:00 Brian Rose: And- They wanna see you succeed. They don’t just want you to entertain them for the next 45 minutes.

1:19:07 They love you as a person. It’s more than just, oh, we’re going to a comedy show and we don’t really know who the guy is. Is that comedy anymore?

1:19:16 Tom Rhodes: You still, I mean, well, for me, going to all these different countries, you still have to prove yourself. It’s not like, when somebody’s really famous, they come out to like a standing ovation and they leave to a standing ovation.

1:19:31 I don’t have that level of fame yet. I think my popularity is, It’s weird because when you think of the word, I told you I’m worried about selling out the Soho theater. I don’t want to sell it out. I just want it to be a decent turnout.

1:19:49 Brian Rose: Sounds like Londoners love you anyways.

1:19:52 Tom Rhodes: But no, I mean just comedy is a weird word because to the layman you think, oh comedy funny joke, but like comedy is such a deep thing, you know, you’re making observations on the universe and the world that no one else notices what you’re noticing. And like your whole backstory brings your presence to the stage and like comedy is like a really it is a whole like long-form story all coming together at once you know

1:20:20 Brian Rose: it’s not just a joke is it

1:20:22 Tom Rhodes: no but yeah but yeah I love jokes and I think I’m a really good joke writer I’ve got some really strong hard-hitting one-liners and stuff but like I was saying about the stories and stuff I mean the truth the things that took a long time to talk about like I was saying you know there’s a story about I shit a bed in Hong Kong and it happened 12 years ago I was too ashamed to admit but it after I was back in Hong Kong two months ago and I told the story on stage very first time I ever told it on stage killed and then I did it on my China tour and then I’ve done it since I came back and like I just didn’t ever want anyone to know that I had ever shit a bed before. There’s another story about this very famous comedian who tried to fuck me when I was 19 and he tricked me into coming back to his apartment and I was very young and naive and I just did not see that this I thought the guy liked me as a comedian and he was a very lascivious creepy guy and and that That story took me 20 years before I told on stage.

1:21:31 Brian Rose: I want to hear more about these stories.

1:21:34 Tom Rhodes: It’s already working. Come to the show this weekend. You’ll get the guy’s name and everything, but yeah, so there’s things like that that just, you know, it took a long time before, you know, you see the humor in something.

1:21:47 Brian Rose: So you’re going to start adding the stories into your other jokes in your, in your comedy?

1:21:53 Tom Rhodes: No, I’ve already done it. You already have. Yeah. I’ve never had one style. I like one liners, I like jokes, I like social things, personal things, political things, and stories.

1:22:07 And why limit yourself to one style? I like to, I mean, it’s like he who throws the most metal wins in war type thing. I mean, you got bullets, you got fucking big bombs, you got lasers. You want to have everything in your arsenal. You got dolphins that sense sea landmines and things.

1:22:31 Brian Rose: I mean, yeah, you got to have a heavy arsenal. Tom, I ask everyone that’s sitting in that chair a question, and I’m going to ask you, if you could make a phone call to the 20-year-old Tom Rhodes and give that young man a bit of advice, what would you tell him?

1:22:47 Tom Rhodes: Don’t worry so much. Everything’s going to work out just fine. You are going to get everything you ever dreamed in life and beyond, more than you ever, ever could imagine.

1:22:58 Don’t drink so much. You’re gonna have some really fine quality women. And maybe you should give a few of them more of a chance.

1:23:12 Brian Rose: That’s good advice. That’s very good advice.

1:23:17 Brian Rose: On that same note, what’s the best advice you’ve ever received?

1:23:22 Tom Rhodes: This is fucked, because I do the same thing on my podcast, I always ask people, what’s the greatest advice you’ve ever been given as a comedian? For the record, I couldn’t answer the questions I’m asking you. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Somebody asked me that day and I was like, what?

1:23:42 Tom Rhodes: Best advice, I mean, so I’m thinking comedy advice, but best advice.

1:23:47 Brian Rose: I’m curious what the comedy advice is, a little bit.

1:23:51 Tom Rhodes: You know, my father was a salesman, And so he gave me some of the best comedy advice ever because I used to go up and I would do something dark or hard Right up in the front and my dad said they’ll buy from a friend before they will a stranger Once you make friends with the audience, then you can take them anywhere I was probably one of the best pieces of advice I’ve ever been given as a comedian but my father also About a year before he died. There was some shit But I was worried about just some typical shit in the career, some club or something.

1:24:30 I can’t even remember what it was. My dad said to me, I was stressed out about something. Maybe it was a woman and he said, you got to find a way to be happy because life goes by quick. He goes, just do me a favor, man. Just be happy.

1:24:51 I don’t fucking worry so much. And I think that’s probably the best advice ever. And I think it applies to everybody and everything. And now that I’m older, you know, it’s true. I mean, life goes by in a fucking blink.

1:25:04 When you’re young and in your 20s and like, you know, my wife is fabulous. And I met her and I came to the point, I’m like, God damn, how many fabulous women am I gonna let slip through my fingers? There was a number of women I should have married. I’m glad I ended up with my wife. And I mean, it took me that much time in my life to realize, fucking these fabulous women don’t come around every day, not women like this.

1:25:30 We just fucking love you and wipe this knot off your nose and make sure everything’s great. And I think being happy is the greatest revenge, man. Just people that have tried to impede your growth as a human or your career or whatever, just living victoriously and just being a happy person. And it’s like, we’re talking about doing the podcast, doing everything yourself now, we live in that world. And it’s great, it brings me joy, makes me happy.

1:26:04 Putting out episodes, my podcast, putting up videos on YouTube, and the fact that I’m one of the few comedians that plays all over the world, and that I don’t live anywhere. and I travel the world with my beautiful wife, she’s a photographer, I’m happy.

1:26:21 Brian Rose: Last part of that question, what’s the advice to the 20-year-old listening that wants to one day grow up like, be like Tom Rhodes? Or to the 20-year-old maybe comedian starting out? What do you tell him?

1:26:34 Tom Rhodes: What would I, I think I just answered it, you know? I mean, just keep writing jokes. Just keep doing what you’re doing. I think the 20-year-old me would be very happy with the way everything turned out. And I think the 20-year-old me would look at me and go, you don’t have a problem in the world, brother.

1:26:55 You’re the coolest guy in the world. I think the 20-year-old me would have thought that the 47-year-old me sitting here right now was a true bad motherfucker.

1:27:05 Brian Rose: Tom, you are a bad motherfucker. You are, I could tell that right when I first met you. Thanks so much for coming on.

1:27:13 Tom Rhodes: Hey man, it’s really great to meet you. I’ve enjoyed what you’re doing in the world.

1:27:17 Brian Rose: Thank you, man. It’s always weird when people tell me they’ve seen my show, so I don’t know how to react.

1:27:23 Tom Rhodes: I know that feeling.

1:27:24 Brian Rose: You know that feeling, so thanks for watching. I appreciate it. You should come back sometime and co-host with me when we have one of the pirate party guys on or something and we can do some crazy.

1:27:34 Tom Rhodes: I would love to do it.

1:27:35 Brian Rose: Copyright pirate angle on these guys, so please do.

1:27:38 Brian Rose: How do people get in touch with you? Twitter, website.

1:27:42 Tom Rhodes: at underscore Tom Rhodes, Tom Rhodes fan page on Facebook. My YouTube channel is King of Haha, appropriately enough. Or you could just type in Tom Rhodes.

1:27:54 Yeah, please follow me on the YouTube channel.

1:27:58 Brian Rose: Yeah, it’s all about the subscribers.

1:28:01 Tom Rhodes: I could use more subscribers. And most importantly, buy my live CDs and come see me when I perform in your sitting.

1:28:09 Brian Rose: Awesome.

1:28:10 Tom Rhodes: This weekend at the Soho Theatre in London.

1:28:12 Brian Rose: Yes, we’re gonna be tweeting the hell out of that three nights. I wish you all the best.

1:28:15 Tom Rhodes: It’s only been 30 years in the making. That’s fantastic, right?

1:28:18 Make it more sweet, right?

1:28:19 Brian Rose: You know, we say on London Real it’s about the journey. Sounds like you’re living that vision. Thanks so much for coming, Tom. It’s been very eye-opening for me and a lot of fun.

1:28:29 Brian Rose: So I wish you all the best.

1:28:39 Tom Rhodes: You too, brother. Respect.

1:28:49 Brian Rose: All right, man, take care.