JB Gill - Food For Thought

Full transcript: JB Gill on London Real

4:28 This is London Real. I am Brian Rose. My guest today is JB Gill, the former member of JLS, one of the UK’s biggest boy bands who sold over 10 million records with five number one singles. You’ve won the BBC’s Strictly Come Dancing and you just recently performed Will Smith’s Men in Black on the ITV show Dance, Dance, Dance with your Mrs. You now live in the countryside where your 11 acre farm produces award-winning turkeys and free-range pork. And you’re a regular face on BBC’s Country Life and your lead presenter on the BAFTA nominated TV show Down on the Farm. JB, welcome to London Real. Thank you so much. You know, the last 10 minutes we’ve been chatting. We’ve been talking about free-range turkeys, you know, boy bands that toured the world. You know, you’re dancing with your wife and you’re doing today you were at the mayor’s office, you know, doing a serious charity work in London. Yeah. I mean, you’re like the Renaissance guy and you’re 30. Do you get that reaction from people a lot? Yeah. You know, sometimes I think people are astonished. You know, even today, as you said, you know, I was doing an event for the Mayor’s Fund for London and I’m the first ambassador for the Mayor’s Fund, actually. And obviously it’s linked to the mayoral office, as you said. And, you know, their real aim is to mobilize the society in London, as simple as that. And obviously working with children primarily through all ages of school life

6:53 To effectively give them the experiences and equip them to get onto the career ladder as they leave school. And so for me, obviously being a young Londoner and having grown up in London most of my life. From like when you were five on the teens, right? That’s it. And then Croydon in my secondary years. And, you know, I’m still in Greater London now. We’re in London Borough of Bromley. So a bit further out, but, you know, we’re still part of what London’s all about. And for me, it’s great to represent something and a charity that’s doing such great work across the country and across the city. Yeah. I think today you were talking about just some basic stuff, like when the students were on break, they weren’t getting properly fed and it was like hundreds of thousands of kids just trying to get them some, you know, basic food. And, you know, again, like you said, I guess just trying to get kids in the urban areas here in London to have a lot of the things that we just assumed they would have. Absolutely. And I mean, don’t get me wrong, there’s a lot of good work that’s being done during school time, you know, and there’s sort of breakfast clubs and, you know, a lot of schools, primary schools and secondary schools are getting children in, you know, in school sort of before it starts to make sure that those who, you know, in underprivileged areas are being fed and are being sustained and being well nourished. And, you know, you’ve seen

8:08 The research that, you know, that’s been put out there by the government and so on about how much difference that makes to their working day. And, you know, even though from your own experience, I’ve, you know, had some pretty long days working before, and if I don’t eat, you know, I can’t concentrate on anything but eating, you know. And so for these kids, you know, where they’re still in their formative years, they’re still learning about life and, you know, we want them to do well in their exams. We want them to be able to come out of school and get great jobs and, you know, to become the pioneers of a new generation. You know, it’s really important to make sure that while we’re doing the work while they’re in school, actually you’ve got about 170 days of the year where they’re not in school, you know, and they’re still in the same family, you know, they’re still in the same areas and they’re still with the same kids who don’t have that access to, you know, to good quality and an abundance of food maybe in other areas outside of the city. So it’s really important for me to be part of that process and, you know, the Mayor’s Fund for London ideas have incredible work to try and, you know, raise the awareness and help people to understand that this is really a serious issue.

9:12 Sounds like you say yes to a lot of things. I mean, you got, I think you got some university coursework I want to talk about later teaching, you know, young people how to get into the entertainment industry. Obviously, former in JLS, you’re dancing on your off nights as well. You know, we were talking earlier, you know, when I see someone like you who’s not afraid to take all these things on, I think that’s what it is. I think you’re comfortable with maybe failure and even though I can’t see many failures here, I’m sure you know all of them we don’t see, but I think a lot of people might retire from JLS and just be like, you know what, I’m just going to either stick to music or keep it on the down low.

9:47 Whereas you seem to go for it and I’m wondering if that comes back to something your mom used to say. I mean, she used to say someone has to be first, can’t it be you? Do you credit a lot of that to your upbringing? Absolutely. You know, I think, you know, both my parents but predominantly my mom really encouraged me to do the best that I could do. You know, she had high expectations for me and you know, obviously, as most mothers do, you know, no matter who the child is, you know, they believe in their children, you know, and they want them to, you know, if they can see that they, you know, got good sport in prowess, they want them to go on and make it professionally or, you know, if they can see they’re really intelligent, they want them to come back with, you know, straight A’s or whatever. You know, my mom always encouraged me. I remember, you know, where that sort of quote came from. I was learning or being tutored when I was probably about eight or nine. And one of the gentlemen who was tutoring me, you know, he really did help me. But I think I was quite far behind in terms of the aspiration that my mom had for me, which was to attend a private school, secondary private school. And he just said, you know, let’s be realistic about this. And he’s doing well, but he’s not at the level that he’d need to be in order to go to, you know, to get a scholarship at one of these schools. And, you know, really and truly at that time, we needed the scholarship. Otherwise,

11:05 I wouldn’t have been able to go, you know, we didn’t have the income at that time to be able to attend one of those schools. And my mom obviously believed in me, believed in my ability. And she said, I expect you to do it, not because you have to do it, but because you’re capable of doing it. You know, and I did end up going to a private secondary school, I did get a scholarship. And that very much stuck with me, you know, and it proved to me that, you know, it’s all about your ability, you know, and if you’re able to do something that can be nurtured, it can be developed, obviously, is an element of natural talent as well. But I think it’s about pursuing the goal, you know, and so for me, for things that I’m really passionate about, things that I love, things I maybe have a natural attitude at, or with, I like to push myself, you know, and just see what happens because a lot of the reason why people don’t make it is not because they haven’t got the talent, it’s just because they give up too easily.

11:57 Talk to me about your teenage years. If I went and bumped into you when you were 13, are you playing rugby? Are you doing the music here? And are you this kind of, you know, young kid that’s just driven? Were you like, I’m gonna make it? Or were you just like, I’m gonna get good at whatever I want to be good at? At 13, I loved music. But I was just becoming, I guess, the typical teenage boy, where, you know, I wanted to be with my friends, you know, I wanted to do what they were doing. I love sport as well. And again, I had a tendency to be good at some of the things, you know, most of the things that I tried, actually. And when I went to secondary school, if you were selected for the school team, any school team, you were required to play, you know, and playing took place on, you know, if you’re playing a school match or whatever, it took place on the weekend, Saturday. And I was actually a member of the Centre for Young Musicians. So I had a place there, I’ve been going there for two years already. And it interfered, actually, with, you know, me playing for the school on Saturday. And, you know, I’ve spoken to my mum since, and she said she’s really upset because she spent so much time nurturing this musical talent, you know, and I really was head and shoulders above anybody at school, any of the people that I’ve been around, even at the C.Y.M Centre for Young Musicians, that they could see

13:19 That I had natural talent. What do they see when you’re natural talent? Like, you pick up the music, you can write music, or what’s… Yeah, I mean, I literally could hear somebody play something and play it back. Wow. Like on a piano or something? Yeah, piano, I played the piano and I played the flute there. And usually, most kids only did one instrument, but I did two. And I did, especially with the flute, because that was probably the instrument I was most proficient at. If I heard something on the radio, on TV, or whatever, or if someone played something to me, that’s how I learned. And, you know, there was very much natural talent from that perspective. And one of the things that I wish I’d done then was develop my musical knowledge. So a lot of the theory I struggled with, because I’d always grown up by hearing something and then replaying that. So the talent was there, obviously. Yeah.

14:10 So teachers, everyone’s like, whoa, watch this kid. Yeah, pretty much. And, you know, I loved it, but at the time, I didn’t understand how music related to, as I say, being a cool teenage kid. Do you know what I mean? And it was like, if I’d known then that you could be on tour with Beyonce around the world playing the flute, because that’s what she had in her band, you know, there’s no way that I would have stopped doing it for Rugby. But, you know, I think it was just a case of I had to go through that process to learn the value of what it meant to me as a person, you know, and to understand, you know, obviously to understand how important it was to stick at something and to learn in its entirety, you know, and it’s just part of my journey. But, you know, I definitely love music, and that’s kind of how I got back into it after I left school. So you stopped it, played Rugby, because that was kind of the cooler thing to do, the thing that felt right, but then you went back to it. Yeah, and I mean, even with Rockbeast, I did very well, you know, I played for the Surrey and the regional side, and I played at London Irish Academy. So they’re like a premiership club, and I played till I was about 18 or 19. I was involved in like Surrey under 21. Two completely different disciplines, you know, also one’s physical, one’s, you know, very mental, and maybe more about a feel. I mean, just comes to my mind, why do you think you were good at both? Do you have a way of looking at things? Do you

15:40 Have a way of breaking things down? Do you demand a lot of yourself? Yeah, I mean, I definitely demand a lot of myself. And as I say, I’ve always been encouraged to, and I’ve always wanted to be the best I can be, you know, and when I compare that to how other people do things, you know, I believe in myself, you know, I believe that I can do certain things, you know, and yeah, I suppose I’ve always, as I say, been encouraged to do things, and I’ve always understood my strengths and my weaknesses, you know, or, you know, been able to understand my strengths and my weaknesses and things that I’m strong at, I want to take on the world pretty much and things I’m not so good at. I’m happy to develop, but I’m not so, I mean, I don’t feel like I need to be the best at everything in the world, but the things I’m good at, I want to be the best at, you know, in the world, if I can, you know. So play to your strengths. Absolutely.

16:31 That’s one of your tips. Absolutely. We’re going to get some pro tips from you today. A lot of people watching, they like to up their performance in lots of ways. So when we have people like you in here, it’s like, I always want to find out why. Just quick question, your first five years you spent in Antigua, right? Yes. Then you’re in Brixton for the next, what, seven or eight or something, then you move on. What’s that like, you know, living in Brixton back then because Brixton changed so much. Yeah. And also not, you know, being in the UK those first five years, you might’ve felt like a bit of a foreigner. I feel like a foreigner in London too.

17:00 It’s all right. But like, tell me what that was like growing up. What do you remember? And then when you go back now, it must seem kind of strange. Absolutely. You know, it was, I love growing up there. You know, I’m not going to lie. Stuff happened, right? Yeah. And it was amazing. I remember one of my fondest memories on the weekend or whatever we used to always cook on a Saturday in my family. And we’d go down to Brixton Market, which still exists, but isn’t what it used to be. I mean, then we’d go pick up different foodstuffs and come go back home and pretty much cook for the week and things like that. Excuse me. And, you know, I loved that, you know, and obviously now I’ve developed that passion for cooking and that’s very much incorporated in what I do now. But, you know, for me, that was probably really, real key bonding time as a family that I appreciate in hindsight, you know. And it was incredible.

17:50 You know, I remember playing with my brother. I’ve just got the one brother and, you know, we used to sort of ride around the area on our bikes and things like that and make friends. And, you know, I never really got into too much trouble. I think we were just, you know, typical, you know, young kids, you know, out on our bikes, having fun. And, you know, as, you know, Brixton’s always had historically always had a bad rep for not being that safe.

18:11 But, you know, I’ve always felt, you know, when I was there, when I was living there, I always felt safe. It’s somewhere that I love to go and especially to stay with my family. And maybe I was just that age, a bit too young to maybe experience it as, you know, a sort of teen or an adult. But, you know, now again, I think Brixton’s changed a lot. And I think, to an extent, it’s a bit of a shame that it’s lost some of its character. But I think still, Brixton’s still a hub, you know, and people embrace it and appreciate it for what it is and what it has been, you know. And it’s good to see it come on a little bit, you know, and, yeah, become a bit more modern as it were. Yeah, it’s kind of fascinating to go there now and see how it’s changed. And I think you mean as far as, you know, rough neighborhoods get that because those are the people that don’t live there that come in. And I think Brixton’s always so accessible from central London. Maybe that’s why it got that rap. So, look, I want to hear about the turkeys and I want to hear about the free-range pork. I actually come from a background where my grandpa raised cattle and my other grandpa grew potatoes and barley. So, I know a little bit about this. I want to talk about it. But before that, we got to get to the JLS adventure. I had Kimberly Wyatt on here talking about the Pussycat Dolls a few years ago. I mean, a few months ago. I know you’re friends. Yes. But it’s always fascinating to me to get a perspective, especially now that

19:28 You’re a few years out, of what kind of happened. And I was just one of you walking through, you got back into music and obviously all these things happen. But as you recollect it now, how did that all evolve? To be honest, when I look at it, I just think I don’t even know how that happened. I mean, I made the conscious decision to go to university in London. I didn’t particularly want to go to university. By that point, by sort of 1819, I knew that I wanted to have a career in music. I always thought it would be as a songwriter or going back to my CYM days and in terms of music production and that element, that side of music, rather than as a singer.

20:06 I mean, I did sing. I’ve been in choirs all my life, pretty much school choirs and church choirs. And even at CYM, they had a couple of choirs I was involved in. But I never sang as an individual instrument, number one. And number two, I never had an aspiration to be a solo artist or anything like that. And I think that element of it did happen by accident almost. And someone that I was doing some vocal coaching and vocal training and some songwriting with got in touch with or met Arisha, who was the founding member of JLS. And he said to her, I’m putting this group together. Do you know anyone who might be interested? And obviously she’s working with me. She knew we were about the same age and said, I met this guy. He seems really, really charismatic and really serious about what he’s doing. Would you be interested?

21:03 If you are, his number, get in touch. So I just thought about it. I thought about it. I was like, I’m not sure. I mean, I know I want to be involved in music, but I don’t know if I want to be in a group. And to be honest, I grew up as a Christian. So I didn’t particularly want to be in a group where guys are just going out and trying to get girls as part of the group.

21:21 Obviously that comes as part of it, but I didn’t want that to be the focus. I wanted people to be serious about their music. So I was like, okay, well, I’ll go see this guy, see what he’s about. And I did, and I liked him. And he was very serious. And he said, the other two guys, they want a holiday at the moment, but I’d love you to meet them. And I like you, but we have to make a group decision and we’ll see if they like you.

21:44 So about two, three weeks later, I went back to see him and obviously Astinam and Marvin as well. And I sang for them. I sang a couple of songs that I’d written, because I was very much about that at the time. And they loved it. And that’s kind of how it all began. And I very much bought that ethos that I’d grown up with. I mentioned about if we can do it, if someone has to be first, why can’t it be you? I bought that ethos to the group, because I said to the guys, as far as I’m concerned, in terms of our talent, we do need to grow and develop. And you’re always growing and developing.

22:19 But I said to them, we’re capable of having international quality, international standard management, and achieving a lot of the things that you see on TV nowadays. And I said, for us, we should hold out for that. Whether we make it traditionally in terms of a label picking us up and then developing something, or obviously at that time, we had shows like Pop Idol and X Factor and things like that. I said, we have to stand up for what we think that we’re worth. And I think we’re capable of that. And that’s what we did.

22:51 We worked hard. We did Best Sun Sign Act competitions. And we managed to win some of those critics’ choice. We didn’t win critics’ choice, but some of those underground awards that the Brits and the mobos and so on do, we launched ourselves into that. We won a UMA Urban Music Award about a year into being together. And we tried to gig and do as much as we possibly could.

23:16 And we did everything ourselves. We stealth styled ourselves. We took our own photo shoots. We did absolutely everything. And we got to the point where we were like, this is not happening the way we want it to happen. But we very much still believed in ourselves. And we knew that if we had the right push, we would be able to make it.

23:32 And that came through the X Factor. And we did the show. And on the show, I remember some of the guys who produced the show and directed it. They said, you guys are really special. And you’re special because of the way that you address everything. We worked extremely hard.

23:50 That was what it was all about for us. We wanted to be the best, but we also wanted to set a standard. We always turned up on time. We were very, very polite. In the years past, we won accolades for being the hardest working and the most polite and the best nature band. And it wasn’t an act.

24:09 That was just what we were all about. And doing the show was great for us because it almost gave us a fast track into something that we’d aspire to achieve. And by the time we did the show, and obviously then came second when it finished, we were ready. We were prepared to have the long days and the PR days and do all the promo for the record and then literally go through the whole process of releasing a record, releasing an album. And we were very much blessed to be able to achieve what we did achieve in the end. But I think that was in part due to the sacrifices and the hard work that we put in at the beginning. Do you think hard work is missing a lot of time in the entertainment industry? Yeah, I mean, most artists that get to the pinnacle of success, I would say, work hard. They have to work hard. What I tend to see nowadays is either a pivotal person making them work hard or an individual who has that desire to naturally work hard. And I think those individuals who have the natural desire to want to work hard will do it in every aspect of their life. The individuals who have a pivotal person making them work hard, that’s when sometimes it falls apart at a later stage. And that’s like a manager or one person in the van pulling everybody forward. Yeah. Okay. And that breaks down over time. That’s it. Maybe it stays together for a year or two while the fame is going on, but then after that subsides

25:47 And the novelty subsides, people start going eh. That’s it. Okay. And so how old are you when you meet these guys the first time? So I was 20. I was 20 actually. And you were serious at the time?

26:00 Yeah. I mean, my 21st birthday. I don’t meet a lot of 20 year olds that are serious. I know. I mean, I don’t know. I just, I knew what I wanted. And I think nowadays, as you say, a lot of 20 year olds don’t necessarily know what they want. But I knew that, you know, I made the promise to myself that I wanted to be full time in music by the time I left university.

26:24 And I said, basically, I’m going to have to leave university in order to pursue a career in music or by, or about six months after I finished, I wanted to have a full time music career. And that pretty much happened. I mean, I, I, I studied for a degree in theology at King’s College University, King’s College London. And I did two years. And then in my third year, that’s when we sort of started the X Factor process. And I had to defer the year because I just couldn’t keep up with, you know, the assignments and things. And I mean, in hindsight, I was a little bit disappointed because I’d have loved to have completed my degree, you know, and it’s something that I know is definitely capable of doing. But I had to give 100% to, to this, this dream that I’ve been following. And again, I knew I was capable of achieving something in that as well. And then obviously, the rest of the say is history. So the gamble, is it word did pay off, but it’s a calculated risk, you know, I knew what I was doing.

27:19 You know, my parents supported me. The university to an extent supported me as well. And, and yeah, obviously it paid off. And you had high standards from the beginning, meaning we want to act and look and perform like a world class band, no cutting corners with what we’re doing and not signing any dodgy record contracts early on. Wait for something big.

27:39 Absolutely. And we were close to doing that, you know, there were a couple of managers who approached us, especially after the Best Unsigned Act with the UMAs, you know, who wanted to work with us and wanted to manage us. And, you know, we were pretty savvy. You know, we did do a couple of bits with some of those guys, but we didn’t sign anything. And we knew that we had something of value that we didn’t want to give away.

28:01 And, you know, it’s important for us to hold on to that. We, you know, we had a lot of integrity of what we were doing, you know, and we were able to suss out, you know, one of the beauties for me, one of the best things about working as part of a team is that you’ve got three, well, with us, you had three other heads that could think and you could reason and you could discuss an opportunity when you buy yourself is slightly more difficult, you know. And I understand why a lot of these younger kids are in the music industry struggle, because you’re having to make a very important decision that affects the rest of your career often.

28:33 And it’s left to a 17 or 18 or 19 year old who hasn’t experienced much of the world. You know, with us, because we’d had Marvin, for example, who’d, you know, he’d been in a group before, you know, they had a little bit of success, but, you know, hadn’t necessarily broken it in the way they wanted, you know, the way that we ended up breaking it. But he had that experience to draw on. And so something that I wouldn’t be, you know, I might be unsure of, we could always run past him. And then something that maybe I, you know, especially from the literary point of view and looking at contracts and things like that, people trying to pull the wall over your eyes, you know, I was no expert and I’d not studied law or anything. But having, you know, been in sort of that university environment, you know, those things didn’t don’t mean, sorry, those things went daunting to me, you know, I wasn’t afraid of reading a contract or reasoning with someone who was older than me or whatever, you know, so, you know, we had a very good package and, you know, we were able to, to help stare each other through some things that probably would have undone us. Had we not had that that support structure. All right, second place you win. What are those next couple of years like? What do you remember as those first kind of like OMG moments that happens after that? Well, after we came second, we did not know what was going to

29:43 Happen because Simon had explicitly said sort of to all the finalists that he was only going to sign the winner. So for us, we were trying to win, you know, and we got very close, obviously. And we were distraught. I mean, you can see in our faces when they announced Alexander as the winner, that, you know, we’re all well, I certainly couldn’t hide it on my face, you know, I was distraught. Not because we hadn’t done well, we had obviously done very, very well. And Alexander was the deserving winner, you know, she’s a great friend of ours now. She’s an incredible artist.

30:14 You know, she’d been trying for just as long as we had, you know, so fair play to her, you know, she did very, very well. How long had you been trying then at that point? Yeah, about a year and a half. So she probably been trying longer than we had. But, you know, we didn’t know what was going to happen. We didn’t know if we were going to get signed. We didn’t know if we were going to have a manager. And the manager, who sort of, I guess, looked after all of the contestants while they were part of the show, he came up to us and he just said, you know, I love you guys, you know, I think you, I’d love to represent you. I could definitely get you a record deal. And, you know, we should take some time to sort of rest and take a bit of time because obviously, it’s just before Christmas. Spend some time with your families and then we’ll get back. And we were very much in the frame of mind that, okay, yeah, we’ll take a few days off, but we want to work. We’re here to work. And we sat down with our live agent, again, who is sort of part of the whole show and would have been with us indefinitely until the end of, you know, they did a tour after the live shows, would have been with us and representing us till after the live shows. And we said to them, we know that we’re going to have the live show and various different gigs after this show. So as far as we’re concerned, and we said this to him, plain as day, we’re still good friends with him now. He said to him, as far as we’re concerned,

31:29 You need to get us three gigs per night, every night, until that point. And he literally was like blown away. And we were just like, no, because as far as we’re concerned, we have an opportunity here. We don’t know whether we’re going to get signed, whether it’s going to last forever or invariably not, you know? And we were like, we need to get in front of the people who voted for us and who’ve put us through this whole process. And we know that if we’re able to do that, you know, we have a much bigger chance. And that’s exactly what we did.

31:58 We literally did not stop for those Thursday months. In London or all around? All around the country, all around the UK. You couldn’t have played three gigs a night every night. Promise you.

32:07 Serious. Ten o’clock, twelve o’clock, two o’clock, every night. Small clubs, you know, some of the oceanas and the whatever else, the bigger clubs that, you know, the students go to or whatever, every single night for the best part of about eight weeks. And we, you know, for us, as I say, it was about us putting into practice what we’d already done as part of the show and just making the most of that opportunity. And, you know, sort of about halfway through that process, I think it was in January, February, and we sat down with our manager and, you know, he gave us incredible news in that, well, the way he broke it to us, he said, I’ve got really bad news, guys. Psycho don’t want to sign you. So we were literally just like, he did not come all this way just to tell us we’re not going to get signed.

32:58 And then he said, but I do have some great news. And at the time, Epic wanted to sign us. And that was under Nick Raphael, Nick Raphael, Joe Charrington. And Nick Raphael. Yeah.

33:09 He’s been on the show like three years ago. There you go. Yeah. He signed Jay-Z back in the day. Yeah.

33:15 I mean, he’s got some incredible stories. Yeah, he does. You hear me and him instead as well. Yeah, that’s it. And he loved us, you know, he and to be honest, we have to give a little bit of credit to Louis as well. You know, he definitely said after the show, because he was our mentor on the show, he said, you know, you guys would do great if you were working with Nick Raphael.

33:31 So when we heard that name come up, we were like, this is incredible. You know, we met him, met Joe, met the team, and he pretty much went straight to work looking for a first single for us. And we had a couple of options and we did the X Factor Tour, obviously. And off the back of that, he suggested that we go on tour with Lamar, who is also another artist that was managed by management. And he said it’d be good for us. It’s a good experience. And, you know, it helped us sort of work out what, you know, what we were about and develop our sound and to perform together and so on. And, you know, that kind of put us in good stead. And after having done all of those sort of club gigs and bits and pieces, you know, when we heard our first single, which is Beat Again, I was on the fence, if I’m honest, in terms of the sound. But, you know, Nick was very, it was adamant, you know, we were working with Steve Mack, who’s just legendary in the industry, who’s a producer, excuse me. And, you know, he’s legendary in the industry, working with Wayne Hector, who also is legendary in the industry. And for them to be able to want to or even want to work with us was just incredible. And we knew we had real potential, you know, real, we were the first act that was going to be releasing. We were scheduled to release, I think, in June or July of 2008. And that was after 2009. And that was going to be before Alexandra was releasing,

34:52 Because she was doing it as part of the X Factor show. And we didn’t know if we were going to get an opportunity to perform on there again, or what. So, you know, when we went through that whole process, we really were putting a lot of faith in that one song. And, you know, Nick 100% believed in the project. He believed in us. And for me, I think the reason why BTN did so well, and why, you know, we had two weeks at number one, and we went straight in at number one, was because of all the work that we’d done, literally getting around the country and playing in front of these people. You know, as soon as they heard the record, which they didn’t even know was us, because obviously it’s the first thing we’ve released, they just loved it. And soon as they heard that it was us, you know, they were, you know, it was definitely something that, for me, you know, kind of blew my mind and was just the start of an incredible about 18 months, where we then went on to win Best British Breakthrough, and obviously to go on and win Best Single for a beat again. Right. So the moral of the story is you can’t, gigging, you got to get back to the basics of gigging and get in front of people.

35:55 The bottom line is when it comes to, for me, when it comes to this industry, and with most industries, it’s all about people, you know, it’s not faceless. You’re selling to people, even now with the farm, you know, I’m interacting with people, you know, I want people to buy into what my ethos, you know, my ethos, the things that I’m passionate about. And once you actually bridge that gap, you know, we’re losing as a society, really, we communicate less and less and less, it’s all on screen, or it’s all sort of behind something, you know, it’s important to still maintain those levels of communication and those channels of communication, because that’s what it’s all about, you know, and we’re shaking hands with people, hugging people, meeting people, you know, having time with people. And you know, you’ve seen how, especially the music industry, with celebrity as a whole over the last sort of six to 10 years, really, it changed from what was originally, you know, that the sort of Michael Jackson era, where it was all about being distant, you know, and creating that that mystery, which is, you know, which is commendable, it’s incredible, you know, I wanted to know, oh, what’s it really like when they do this? And what’s it really like when they do that? And how they do that? And how they write their songs, you know, when we were doing it with JLS, it was all about how accessible it can be. So inviting people to see that process. And nowadays, you know, with all the right reality

37:15 TV, we do people want to see exactly what you do. That’s what famous they want to see, you know, how you are when you’re angry, how you are when you’re happy, how you are when you wake up, you know, they want to see it all. And so we were just in that transitional phase, you know, from the mystery into reality, you know, and for us, it was about, as I say, that FaceTime, that interaction time with our fans and people who’ve been supporting us on what was essentially a reality TV show. Wow, that’s fascinating. It’s a really good observation. So all right, number one hit single. What are those next few years like? Are they a blur? Do you remember it? Do you remember at all? What were some of the highs and lows of those next three or four years? Yeah, man, you know, those next few years were definitely a blur.

37:56 You know, it was crazy, like, we literally went through, for me, one of the one of the biggest lows, and it’s still something that I’m very aware of when we’re when I’m working over the farm with my family and stuff is not having that time of family, you know, and that was what it was all, you know, for us, we put 100% into the group. That’s what it was about. The group came first, you know what I mean? And we made that conscious decision. And obviously, four young guys, you know, we’re all bachelors, you know, we were happy to do that, you know, and that’s kind of what we we did. We focused on we wanted to make sure that, you know, there was never going to be an excuse for not having the success that we, you know, aspire to, because we didn’t put in the time, you know, we made sure and as a result of that, that’s probably, as I say, the biggest load for me, you know, not being able to go to weddings, not being able to go to family events, you know, not being able to go to birthday parties, things like that, you know, and we’re all family men, you know, we’ve all been grown up with big families, especially Marvin and myself and, you know, the boys, you know, we’re all, as I say, very much closely associated with our family. So that was a big deal for us, you know, but we knew that’s what it needed, you know, that’s what it needed to that’s what it took for us to succeed. So you’re working every week of the year, pretty much. Pretty much.

39:14 Touring, recording, you just give yourself over to the success of the band for four years. Yeah, I mean, there were times when we literally did not have a break for about three months, you know, every single day we’re doing something for about three months. And, you know, that’s probably one of the reasons why we got the title of hardest working band in industry, you know, and, you know, who has that title before, right? It was James Brown in America. There you go. They’re stories about legendary about him about, well, first of all, working really hard. He had his whole crew, you know, no drink and no partying during the circuit.

39:50 You know, he’s known for rehearsal, rehearsal, rehearsal, rehearsal, and now putting on some of the greatest shows that ever were. Yeah. Did you ever think about him and like think about some of those like work ethics and compare yourself to that? Definitely. Definitely. And we drew our inspiration from a lot of, a lot of, as you say, the great, you know, you know, Stevie Wonder and people like that, you know, Michael Jackson, obviously.

40:12 And, you know, it’s really, for us, we really wanted to make our own claim on the industry, you know, the music industry. And, and, and obviously, as I say, coming from London, being, you know, born and bred in the UK for us, we were very passionate about that. And, you know, some of the highs, you know, one of the biggest highs is obviously working with the boys, you know, we got to travel, travel the world pretty much together. And, you know, we got to meet some incredible people. I remember one time we were coming through the, the airport and we were in, I think we’re going to LA and we’re probably going to be out there for a good, a good long while writing, recording, you know, a gig and things like that.

40:45 And we had this little argument, Arish, they brought it up and I think Marvin was probably, Marvin likes to ask him these big musical questions because research has grown, research has grown up, you know, with music, like in its blood pretty much. He’s very passionate about some of the old school ways of music. And we know we incorporated that into how we worked. And, you know, we were asking, who do you think is better in terms of commercial aspect of, out of Stevie Wonder and Brian McKnight? And we all pretty much, you know, agreed that it was Stevie Wonder. We were winding up Arish and, you know, a couple of us said, oh, Brian McKnight’s done this and Vokalee is that and obviously Stevie’s legendary and he’s Disney’s that, you know. And so we had this, you know, obviously very friendly argument. And, you know, we went into the business class lounge and, you know, which obviously was again a great privilege, something that we loved and who should walk past us but Stevie Wonder.

41:49 And literally Arish went, hey, that’s Stevie, as if he knew him, you know. And we literally, we did. We stopped him and we said hello and we have a photo with him. And then, you know, we were kind of talking to him about what we do and we’re part of a group and we’re this and that. And, you know, he was incredible, you know, he was very friendly and very open and he could see that we were working hard. And, you know, he’d heard a little bit about what we were doing. And, you know, he’s very much clued up, obviously, clued up about the industry and what was going on, even in the UK, you know, and we didn’t expect him to know who we were or anything like that.

42:20 You know, he said, you know, you guys keep working hard, you know. Even though I don’t know that much about you, I’m very proud of you and I think you guys, you know, onto a great thing. And, you know, just little things that are just so surreal, you know, you could never ever imagine that or picture that, you know. We got to experience stuff like that, which, you know, goes down in our history, you know. That’s pretty cool. Hi.

42:40 Yeah. Tell me something about the music industry that only you would know, that I wouldn’t know. If you’re like, Brian, the music industry all comes down to X or what it’s really about is Y. I mean, what can you tell me? You were in it.

42:51 Oh, man. I just think there’s so many elements in the music industry that you can’t pinpoint one thing that it comes down to. But I think if anyone looking to get into music and being passionate about pursuing a career in music, they just have to understand what they’re about, what they want to portray, really, how they want to portray themselves. And I think you’re seeing you start to see that more now. You know, you’re seeing things which are less sort of fabricated and formulated. And you’re seeing people who are more open about what they want to do, more singer songwriters, more people who are natural musicians, things like that.

43:32 You know, and that’s not to say that, you know, the history, you know, the area, especially if you look at boy bands, you know, that’s not to say that the era wasn’t very productive, you know. But I think now music comes down to how you express yourself, you know, and I think it’s important for people to not take that for granted, you know, and to work hard at their craft, you know, and express themselves in the way that they feel they want to be expressed. So express themselves in the way they feel they want to express themselves, but also recognize their audience, you know, and that’s one thing that I feel we did as a group.

44:05 We knew that, you know, our audience was a young person’s market, you know, we weren’t ever going to be sort of that cool R&B slash hip hop star that we grew up with, you know, but we still made music that we loved, you know, we still wrote, we wanted to make sure that we were in all the sessions that, you know, for the music that was produced for us. If anyone wrote a song for us or whatever, we wanted to make sure that we knew, you know, what they were thinking about the song and the whole, you know, the whole understanding about it. And, you know, I think people appreciated our music more because of that.

44:36 And advice you give to people is just be real and be yourself and let your music be a true reflection of you. Absolutely. Because that’s how stars are made. And when you’re not yourself, that’s when people don’t make it, right? Yeah, when you’re not yourself, that’s when it falls apart because that means that someone can give you another idea and you’ll be like, yeah, okay, we’ll do that. And then they give you another idea and be, yeah, okay, you do that. And as soon as you’ve done that two or three times, you then become an artist that people can’t, they can’t identify with. They’re like, well, what is he or she? Are they that?

45:04 Are they this? Are they a mixture of the two? You know, so that’s not to say you can’t change and develop, you know, I’m testament to that fact, you know, you can change and do different things, for sure. But I think you have to understand why you’re doing it. And when people then question you and say, oh, well, how come you decided to go and do that? And you say, well, this is the reason why. And you’re very eloquent in, you know, in portraying that. And as I say, that that’s the realism that people, especially in this day and age, want to see.

45:29 How’d you know when it was all over? And did you always know that this was going to be one part of your life and there were going to be other parts of your life? I did always know that this would be one part of my life. In part, again, down to my mom, you know, she said these things don’t last forever. But I also knew that it wouldn’t last forever, because we’re four different guys. You know, we come from different backgrounds, although they are reasonably similar. And we’re four different individuals with four different aspirations. You know, so it’d be impossible for us to be together forever, you know, and I never kidied myself, you know, I never for once sort of, you know, deceived myself to think that this is going to be forever. But at the same time, you know, I think we wanted to make it last for as long as possible. And we kind of got to the point where, you know, we can’t the reason why we decided that, you know, this is the time for us to go our separate ways is because we got to the end of our record deal, which is the first time I think An Ex Factor Act had achieved that, in the sense that we’d released four albums and then went on to release the greatest hits. And we’d completed our record deal, you know, which is pretty much unheard of at the time. And for us, it was the right time to step back, you know, excuse me, we were at high, you know, we were still performing around arenas around the country, you know, we were still,

46:53 You know, recording number one singles and number one albums and things like that. And we, you know, we’re still winning awards. I think we over the course of those five years, you’d won like five, five mobos, things like that. And, you know, we were very much at the height of our career, you know, and for us, the question really was, do we want to continue this for another five or 10 years with another four or five album deal? And when we get to that eight or, you know, nine year period where, you know, we start to get slightly older, and maybe our influences change, and maybe we want to experience different things, we’re held and tied to a deal that affects that future. Or do we want to be free and clear to do whatever we want to do? You know, and we made that conscious decision to say we want to have the power, we want to be free and clear to do what we want to do. If you want to be signed by Universal or signed independently, set up your record label, you can do that. You know, if you want to still be signed with Sony, you can do that. You want to do a solo album, brilliant. You don’t want to do anything involved in music. Brilliant, you know. And for us, you know, it was a tough decision, but that’s the reason why I guess it took a good year and a half for us to actually get to the point where we weren’t releasing music anymore, because it was about making sure that we,

48:07 I guess, gave our fans who’d supported us for that period of time, the right farewell. And also for us as well, in terms of performing, you know, we’ve gone from the group being our focal point for all that time to all of a sudden something else potentially being our focal point. And yeah, you know, it’s a brave decision to make, but I think at the time it was the right one. Fighters and musicians a lot of times hang on too long. You know, we’ve seen the UFC, we see it in boxing sometimes where you’re like, man, the last three fights, whether you’re Tyson or anyone, you know, they even admit they wish they had enough, but it’s hard to quit.

48:47 Like you said, it’s a hard decision. And I don’t know if this applies, but you know, George Michael recently died and it was really tragic, but just also watching his life the last five years or 10 years was kind of tragic, you know, and he just seemed to be not happy. And I just wonder if it’s hard trying to hang on to the music business sometimes, or if there was more than that. Do you see that in other people that just don’t know when to walk away? I think one of the biggest and most mature decisions that any person can make as an individual is to know when to stop, you know, and that goes across the board, no matter what you do in life, whether it’s private life or work life or family life, whatever it is, you know, and a lot of people find it difficult, especially when it was something like entertainment, because, you know, it’s a fast life, you know, it is attractive, it is appealing, you know, there’s a lot of things that people can be hooked by, you know, and there’s a lot of things that are, as I say, appealing and really draw you in, you know, and you feel like you want to have that all the time, you know, being exposed to being in front of a hundred thousand people or whatever, a gig and people screaming and singing your songs or chanting for you or wanting you to, you know, to be with them or whatever.

50:05 And people love that, you know, because you feel good, you feel nice. For me, I never, you know, I enjoyed it, but it was never something that defined me, you know, I wasn’t defined by my career, I wasn’t defined by being a member of JLS, although that is part of, or that was part, in fact, a very big part of my life, you know, I was defined by, or I am defined by a lot of other things, you know, and so for me to make that decision and, you know, to be part of that whole process and to say, do you know what, I want to do something else or, you know, to be part of, I guess, a process and then step back from it and say, you know what, people are not going to be screaming my name in the same way next year, wasn’t daunting for me. So, you know, I believe the same for the boys, you know, they didn’t feel that we needed to hold on to that, you know, for as long as possible and, you know, for us, as I say, we wanted to be in a position of strength going forward. Whatever we did, whether it was music or not, you know, we wanted to be in a position of strength so that people didn’t feel like, oh, they’re just doing it because they’re trying to squeeze every last drop out of it, you know, and we didn’t want to go from being top of the industry, number ones and so on, to then squeezing out singles, you know, or, you know, having to perform back in those clubs that we had to perform in when we first started out, you know, because we always wanted to grow and progress and as soon as we knew that

51:31 We weren’t growing and progressing in the way that we’d like to have done, and as soon as we’d achieved, you know, the vast majority of the UK industry anyway, you know, that was kind of, that was when we said, okay, this is a situation, this is what we want to do now. How much of your Christian faith helped you through that time or even helped you on tour and how much of it conflicted with what happens on tour? Yeah, well, to be honest, as I was growing up, my Christian faith wasn’t as strong as it is now, you know, and I think, you know, that was just part of me growing and learning as a young adult, and I think at the point when I decided, well, myself and the boys decided, this is, you know, we’re going to change tactic here, I think that was a very key moment for me as an individual growing up, you know, maturing and saying, you know, I spent this time with a group where often, I’ve had to go with the flow in certain instances, and that’s just semantics of any industry, sometimes, or if you’re working in an office or whatever and you’ve got a boss and so on, sometimes when you want to do, you have to do things that you don’t necessarily want to do, you know, I’m glad that there weren’t many instances like that with us, but I think at that point, sort of, maybe about, what was it, three or four years ago now, I thought to myself, what do I stand for as an individual? What do I want to be about?

52:51 The choices that I make, what are they going to be based on? Are they going to be based on things that don’t last forever, you know, like fame and things like that, or are they going to be based on things that are real, you know, or real to me anyway, and that’s kind of when, I guess, that began to form a lot more of my decisions and began to become the foundation upon which I based a lot of my decisions in life. Okay, now the latest footage I saw of you, you’re walking out with a bale of hay on the wheelbarrow, right, and you’ve got turkeys all around you, and like even the, it can’t be lost on you, the contrast from sitting in front of 100,000 people to, you know, being this proper farmer, like serious, you know, it’s not just a cosmetic farm, like you’re out there doing real work, you know, it’s a business as well, right, just walk me through how we make that transition and why you chose to go that way, and what were people saying in the beginning? I mean, you must have taken some flack, right?

53:46 Absolutely, I mean, there was definitely a lot of naysayers at the beginning, and I mean, it came out of left field, you know, almost a bit like the group thing came out of left field for me from a musical perspective, you know, that definitely came out of left field for me from a career perspective, of course, and it’s not something that I even had any experience of other than sort of growing up sort of in the outdoors and my dad keeping horses and things like that when we were in Antigua, you know, I’d never really experienced that in, you know, growing up in the UK anyway, and so it was something that, you know, was a little bit daunting, and did take a bit, you know, took a lot to make that decision, but it kind of came about because where I, when I moved out of my family home, and I bought my first place, I bought where I am now, with Chloe, and obviously I used to now grow up, and I bought the additional land because my mom said, well, land is a very, very valuable commodity, you know, you can’t get any more of it on this earth, it is what it is, and if you can have your own patch, do it, you know, and it came as part of the property, so I was just like, cool, let’s go ahead, and I kind of got a bit tired of having to tend it and get someone in to cut it back and, you know, make hay for me, and obviously I was traveling a lot at the time, I didn’t have the time to look at it myself, and to be honest,

55:05 I didn’t have any desire to look at it myself at the time, and then about sort of three years or so through JLS, on the other JLS experience, you know, to say that whole decision about what do I want to stand for in life, what do I, you know, what do I want to do, you know, as and when this may end, what is life about, you know, do I want a family, all those kinds of questions that you kind of, well, I got to at 25, but some people, you know, people get to as they get sort of older and closer to that, you know, having kids and so on and so forth, you know, I really wanted that to be part of my story and part of my life, you know, and one of the reasons why I lived sort of out in the outskirts of London as opposed to in central London is because when I did have a day off, I liked that peace and just that tranquility and, you know, doesn’t mean I have to hear the, you know, the sounds of the countryside. Right, no beeps, that’s what you’re saying, right?

55:55 Yeah, no horns, no sirens, you know, just peace. And you need that to calm yourself down. Well, that’s it. It’s just almost that little bit of escapism. And as I say, for me, home was a valuable commodity as well. You know, I didn’t get that much time at home.

56:08 So for me, it was really important to have, you know, that one day off that I did get in three months to be able to spend it at home, maybe have my family members over and so on. And I just got to the stage where I was like, I have this valuable piece of land. What can I do there? You know, why just sit there and let it go to waste? You know, I didn’t want to waste any of the things that I was good at or any of the things I was passionate about.

56:34 And one of the reasons why farming became such a strong thing for me was because, number one, not only do I love food, number two, not only do I love preparing it and cooking it and working with it, number three, for me, it’s valuable, obviously, to life, you know, and it’s something that would last forever. You know, whereas the fame and things like that, they don’t last forever. Food lasts forever. We always need food, you know. And so for me, I was passionate about that. But also, I’d done a lot of research and I’d sat down and I’d gone through all the pros, all the cons, all the things that needed to happen for me to do it and, you know, what would happen, maybe negatively if I did go ahead with it. And I got to the point, which is where I’m at now, where I could do all of the things that I was good at. So I was, you know, being in the media spotlight and so on and so forth. Invariably changed lives, you know, along the way, invertently, by promoting food welfare and how food is produced and, you know, educating young people and things like that. But at the same time, also do something that was different, you know, and, you know, still do music, still, you know, be creative, you know, still develop concepts and things like that, which is what we did as part of J.L.S., you know, getting in the studio and working on stuff. And I guess the end goal for that was obviously to do as well as we could in

57:57 The charts. The end goal for this is less that, but still to add impact to the people that we’re dealing with on a different level. And how is your farm different? Or if I go out to your farm, I’m like, what are the core values of J.B. as far as what he grows, how he grows it, what would I find I can visit, I think, right? Yeah, for sure. I mean, we’re not exactly an open farm in terms of leisure experience, but that’s definitely something that we want to grow towards.

58:25 And I’m very much looking at this year because, you know, especially my work at the Mayors Farm for London and, you know, some of the initiatives that they’re doing, it’s really important for people to kind of see that firsthand, you know, and we were talking sort of before we began this, you know, there’s lots of kids who live in those urban areas who just don’t even think they’re not exposed to what goes on in the rural areas, even of London, you know. And so it’s important for me to be able to open that up to people. And again, as I say, be able to change lives and be able to add that wealth of experience to people, to young people. But at the same time, you know, for me, it’s about trying to, you know, do things there that for me are as close to the natural environment I rear animals pretty much at the farm. We don’t grow anything out of all as yet. But, you know, I want to have something that’s very ethical, you know, extremely high welfare standards, and as I say, is contributing positively to the food chain.

59:20 Okay. What’s the biggest problem you think we face right now when it comes to food in the UK globally? Is it a big disconnect from like where our food comes to like even the whole concept of sustainability? Or is it that just we’re making horrible choices with like, you know, high fructose corn syrup, somewhere just eating things that just aren’t even natural, that aren’t even grown on a farm? What’s like the big red alarms for you when you look at that?

59:44 I mean, I mean, it sounds bad, but there are quite a few, to be honest. And I think the biggest thing is probably the disconnect that we have with our food at the moment. You know, as a society, especially in the UK, you know, and definitely in the Western world, where food is abundant, you know, for want of a better term, you know, I think the reason why we have so many issues around food waste, and you know, you still have countries, you know, cities affluent like London, you know, and, you know, huge economies, but still got so much poverty, you know, and it’s because there’s that disconnect with how our food is produced, where our food comes from, you know, I know people say to me, you know, they’re right on Twitter, or whatever, and say, I can’t believe you’ve got a farm, and, you know, it’s so bad of you to kill animals, and, you know, to produce meat and things like that, I think to myself, are you joking? Like, we eat food, and we need food to live, you know, and whether you’re killing a plant, because you have to cut it down in order to eat that too, you know, or it’s an animal, you know, you’re contributing to the food economy. And I think a lot of the reason why people are upset about that is because on the other end, there’s so much food waste, because we’re so used to having any food we want from anywhere in the world, all year round, you know, that, that for me is where the education needs to be developed, you know, from kids who don’t know anything,

1:01:07 And obviously we’re teaching them the first things about food, but also in adults, you know, people who will go somewhere who will buy a salad and waste half of it, because, you know, they’re concerned about body image, or people who will go and, you know, they’ll buy a steak in a restaurant and waste half of it, you know, an animal had to die in order for that steak or whatever to get onto the plate. So it’s important to respect that, you know, and I think if we can challenge some of the ways that we view food, and some of the, you know, some of the things that we have come to understand as a society, I think will go a long way to change in the way food is viewed, and the way that food is produced, and the way that food is consumed within our society.

1:01:47 You went deer hunting recently, I don’t think you got, you shot any deer, but you were some famous chef, and I was wondering, do you get flack from maybe some of the same people that are like, you know, how can you hunt that kind of thing? And also, I’m curious what you feel about hunting, because some hunters feel that that’s actually the most ethical way to consume an animal, because you go out, you hunt that, you bring it home, you eat with your family, and it’s just like the best way of eating meat. How do you feel about it, and do you get heat from it?

1:02:12 I definitely get heat from it, but I feel exactly as you’ve just expressed it, when you’ve hunted an animal, and the purpose of doing that, the purpose of that process is to contribute to the food chain, whether it’s personally, for the family, or for a business or whatever, that’s going to enter into the food chain as a restaurant, or whatever, as a food outlet. For me, there’s no issue with it. When people do a lot of what I call trophy hunting, things like that, I’m very interested in venison and developing the farm to have an element of venison sales and things like that. When people go out and hunt just because there’s a 15-point stag or whatever, I have a big problem with that, because I don’t think there’s the respect for the animal and the respect for the food source.

1:03:01 And again, it boils down to the fact that it’s wasted. It becomes a waste. For me, I’m not necessarily someone who would go hunting or enjoys the sport of hunting. Of course not. I don’t agree with that, if I’m honest. But in terms of that process, in order to get that food source to the table, absolutely. And I think if it’s done in an ethical and humane way, there’s also a way that you can hunt and it be humane. And there’s also a way to hunt and it be inhumane and be cruel to the animal. And I think those are very hot topics within our society, and I respect those topics. And I think that it’s something, again, that should be addressed. Even within the farm environments where you’ve got abattoirs and so on, you want to have abattoirs that are processing animals in a very humane way. And those animals aren’t suffering, and they’re not in pain. And they’re not struggling for life when it comes to that moment. But I think at the same time, we have to supply the demand for food. We still have a lot of work to do in terms of waste, but we do need to eat in order to live. And whether that’s vegetables or meat, I think we have to make sure that the whole process, whatever it is, is done in the best possible way.

1:04:21 You know, a few days ago, you danced in Will Smith with your wife on stage, right? Today, you’re the mayor of London’s office. You know, people like to pigeonhole people, you know? Like, people thought he was the JLS guy, and now he’s the farmer guy, and then he’s on BBC. Is this the new reality, you think, when it comes to what humans are allowed to do today?

1:04:41 Is this just you, or should we just accept the fact that people can do many things? Well, I personally think the value of a person isn’t necessarily in how other people value them, because we’re all unique, we’re all individual. And there’s things that I would like that will coincide with things you like, and then there’s things that you’re going to like that are totally different to the things that I’m going to like. Of course, even in my marriage, I love being married, and I think that marriage is the joining of two people, and it’s important for them to grow as, and they become one person really and truly, but they’re still individuals, and it’s important for those individuals to still be able to express themselves.

1:05:18 So for me, aside from that, for me in terms of my career, I want to do things that I love, I want to do things that I’m passionate about, I want to do things that I’m skilled in, and if that happens to be farming, but also dancing, but also singing, but also music production, but also sport, then fair play, so be it. And I don’t think it’s up to somebody else to say that I’m not allowed to do that. And I think, again, even for me, with my son, I think it’d be wrong for me to tell him, as he’s growing up, as his first mentor, or one of two first mentors alongside his mom, for me to say, well, no, when you were growing up, I thought you were good at sport, so you should do sport. He should be able to express himself, and obviously, I guide him and encourage him in things I think he is good at.

1:06:07 But it’s a very individual journey, and I think that one of the biggest issues with people and their confidence and the way that we’re developing as individuals in what is an incredible world society, is that freedom of expression, and being able to be unique. Because there is nobody else on earth who’s the same as me, and every single individual on earth right now is unique. When I see the choices you’ve made, I see a guy who must not care what other people think. Is that true?

1:06:42 I mean, to an extent, I always, like anybody else, of course I’m conscious about what other people think, but as I say, it doesn’t define me. So I’ll bear it in mind, I’ll weigh up the pros and the cons, I’ll reason, I’ll think about, okay, so what did that comment really mean? Is that comment said because it’s someone who cares about me, who wants to see me grow and wants to see me develop and wants to see me achieve my potential as an individual, or is it something that’s just said, someone who doesn’t really know me, or who just wants to say a bad word, or whatever, you see on the internet all the time, people have an article and they’ll want to slate it, but they don’t know me.

1:07:19 They don’t know some of the people that they’re commenting about, and I think it’s important for you to understand the value in what’s being said also, and who it’s being said by. If there’s someone, as I say, who genuinely has a care for you, then yeah, take that on board, and maybe change something that you did or want to do. But when it’s somebody who doesn’t really have that understanding of you as an individual, for me, I just throw caution to the way you take it with a pinch of salt. If there’s something you’re really passionate about, you keep fighting, you keep pushing, and you hope to achieve what you set out to do.

1:07:50 And what about risk? I mean, a lot of things you do are risky. I mean, even going to this farming business is risky. Going out on Dance Dance Dance to do a number is risky. Is that something, are those calculated risks for you? Are you like, look, I always got to be pushing the envelope in these things to feel good about myself, because you could easily not do those things? Yeah, definitely. I mean, some people would think that I’m a thrill seeker. I don’t think I especially am. But for me, I do like to push myself.

1:08:18 And I do like to do as much as I can that’s outside the envelope, and just find out who I am as an individual. And I think it is risky, but I like to take calculated risks rather than just throw caution to the wind all the time anyway. And I think there’s times that you take throw caution to the wind and just go ahead and do it. And there’s times where you do weigh it up and say, okay, maybe I won’t do that. For me, my family probably is the most essential thing to most of the decisions that I make now, that and my faith. And for me, I sit down with my wife with most things and say, right, Chloe, I’ve done this, and someone suggested doing this, or maybe this is an opportunity to work. How does that work? And some of the things I’ll immediately dismiss or immediately say yes to because I know perfect or not so perfect. And then some of the things would take a little bit more thought, which I have to see how that impacts on the family. And one of those things was dance, dance, dance. I mentioned that Chloe’s the next professional dancer, and she’s grown up with dance. She’s been dancing since she was three years old.

1:09:18 She got one of her first professional jobs, if not her first professional job from Brian Friedman, who I think you’ve interviewed on the show before. And she grew up with him. He’s one of her pretty much idols. And so for her, having to take that step back and start a family pretty much, and having Ace and being his primary carer and looking after him full time as a mum, that was a big change in her life, especially, but obviously in our life. And having a son as well, obviously for myself, it’s a big change in any parent’s life. So for me, doing a show was a risk that we had to take because we’re both doing a show. Usually I’m away or Chloe’s away.

1:09:58 And now we’re both away. We’re both spending time in rehearsals, up to 20 hours a week, training and so on. And that has an impact on Ace’s life because we’re the primary carers of looking after him. He’s not at school yet. He’s still too young. So it’s a big decision, but for us, it ticked so many boxes and so many of the passions that we had, like dancing together, which we hadn’t been able to do professionally in our lives.

1:10:22 For Chloe, being able to get out of the house and do something that she’s always growing up, doing, wanting to do, and for the want of having Ace, if we hadn’t had a child at that time, she probably would still be in the industry. She’s a young lady. She’s still 28 and there’s lots of older dancers who she was on the circuit back then with that are still dancing now. So I have no doubt that she’d still be working in the industry had she not had Ace. So for us, it was the perfect opportunity to work together for her to find a great sense of achievement as a mum, as a young mum, and also to represent young mums as well. So a lot of mums especially feel bad about having a child and the way their body looks and things like that. And it absolutely is nothing to feel bad about. And it doesn’t limit you. There’s no reason why you can’t come back and do something physical again and enjoy sharing those special moments with others, individual with your career or with a partner, with your husband, whatever it might be. And for us, we absolutely enjoy doing the show. It’s incredible working together. We’re having an absolute blast and it’s a lot of fun. It’s a memory and it’s an experience that we’ll never, probably ever be able to share again, privately, yes, maybe, but definitely not professionally.

1:11:42 So we took it with both hands. Yeah, yeah. How do you deal with fear? Because I find that most of the people that sit in this chair have found a way to deal with fear and found a way to manage fear in order to move past it. And I’m sure you’ve met people along the way in the music industry that couldn’t get past that.

1:12:01 And you might have been like, why don’t you just do that, man? Go for it. And they never could. You’ve obviously managed a way around it. Do you have a certain relationship with it when something gets a little scary with you? Do you try to rationalize? How do you deal with it?

1:12:13 Yeah, I mean, my faith, especially now, has a huge element towards me handling fear now. And I suppose before I was probably like most, well, certainly growing up, a lot of my friends and most young people, you have less fear when you’re younger because you’ve not been hurt yet. You’ve not gone through an experience where you’ve been negatively impacted by something. So for you to jump into something with a lot less responsibilities, overall, in terms of life, you just, yeah, cool. We’ll go here or we’ll travel to that country or we’ll try that job or we’ll do something. And if we get sacked, you get sacked. You’re less strategic maybe in some of the decisions you make. But now, I like to weigh things up, as I say, take calculated risks. But at the same time, I think the biggest thing that you find that I can do to combat fear is to really understand, number one, your worth and what the end product is. And if you know it’s something that you really are passionate about, or if you know it’s something that’s really going to have a profound impact on you or your family or on the public, on the everyday person, then pursue it. And even if someone tries to discourage you, even if it’s something that you’re scared about, okay, yeah, you might be scared, but at the same time, you know that it’s going to have such an impact. For me, that’s what drives me through. Think of the higher reason you’re doing it. Yeah. And that whole aspect of it,

1:13:43 For me, and anywhere, that whole aspect of it, you know that you’re doing something that’s going to be so much bigger than if you didn’t do it, have so much more impact than if you didn’t do it. And as a result, that kind of drives me through. Right. Yeah. Like a reason other than your own personal failure for doing it, if you’re doing it for your family or for the public or for God or something, then it’s just like, let’s do this. That’s it. That’s strong. These success secrets are only available on the London Real Academy. Become a member and get access to live shows, exclusive courses, my webinars, bonus content, meetups, live events, an amazing community and much, much more. Now back to the rest of the show. It’s your 40th birthday.

1:14:35 You’re coming back on London Real and you’re Brian, let me tell you all the stuff that’s happened. What’s going on with you? What’s going on with the farm? What’s going on in your life? Like, what does it look like? Wow. Well, you know, really there’s three, I mean, I call it the empire, but there’s three major things that I want to try and achieve in terms of my career at the moment. And it all centers around the farm. So I really want to have a huge presence in the media in terms of whether it’s the television shows I’m looking to develop or again around awareness about farming. So yes, intellectual, but also entertainment based and just literally hitting almost every single pillar of society in order to change the way that food is viewed.

1:15:16 So obviously working with politicians who pass legislation, working with other entertainment artists or sports people or whatever, who are, you know, who are at the top of that industry and who are, you know, the spokespeople for, for, you know, lots of various different things, whether it’s the family and getting people from grassroots level, you know, kids and education and stuff like that. You know, I really want to use my, my talents within the media and my position within the media to try and bring that across the farming. In terms of the farm business, every animal that I produce and particularly with the venison, which I hope to go into and will go into. So in 10 years time, we’ll be talking about that. You got your eye on a bunch of acres up in Scotland. Absolutely. And around the country, you know, I really want to, number one, supply the food industry, but number two, be able to use every single aspect of the carcass.

1:16:11 So I want to make sure that whether it’s the antlers, whether it’s the skins, whether it’s the hooves, whatever it might be, obviously the meat, you know, not what, not any part of that animal is wasted. And obviously, as I say, contributing to the food industry. And that’s in terms of the farm. In terms of, as I mentioned, the sort of the leisure part of it, being able to open up the farm and have it as a hub for people to come, whether they’re learning at nursery level or school level, whether they’re part of, you know, I guess the, the, the teen slash young people getting into the career ladder and coming to work there and develop skills and, you know, whether they’re vets or whether they’re farmers or whether they’re just people who want to learn different skills, being able to come and experience the farm. And also to be able to add value to people who are just coming, whether they’re coming to meet me or just coming to enjoy that, that lifestyle, you know, be able to offer that. And then, you know, finally, I really want to develop myself in terms of on the literary side of things. So writing about my experiences and developing concepts, which, you know, able to contribute to more the entertainment side of things. But, you know, as I say, still with that farming undercurrent, you know, so writing books and things like that, developing, you know, TV concepts and stuff like that, which, you know, I hope will, you know, be very, very successful.

1:17:31 You don’t have a lack of grand plans, do you? No, I mean, they’re all very, very big, big, big plans. Do you have like whiteboards all over the farm and like you got all your things drawn out and vision boards and stuff like that? Yeah, pretty much. You know, and I’ve got my wife’s really good, actually, she’s really organized. So she, you know, we write big, massive sort of eighth, eighth, eighth, one pieces of paper, we’ve written all our plans and stuff down. And, you know, for us as well, you know, one of the biggest things that we did as JLS and one thing that I’d love to do again is to give back, you know, so, you know, once I’ve developed a lot of those concepts, and, you know, hopefully they do well and they’re successful, I’d love to be able to, you know, donate a lot of my, some of my time and obviously some of my finances and so on, to helping others, you know, it was a lot of the work that the Mayors Farm for London are doing, you know, it was a lot of the work that, you know, other organizations I work with, you know, there’s so many incredible causes out there that are helping young people, helping children, helping our society as a whole, helping people in the developing countries, you know, all of that sort of stuff, you know, really helping people to come and identify things like that, but also assisting them, you know, and empowering them, you know, because I’ve had so many incredible

1:18:40 Experiences. And for me to be able to help other than the next generation or, you know, people in our society in general, I think is important for me to do. And it’s not something that I shy away from. And it’s a responsibility I take very seriously. Yeah, and it’s important part and it brings you back so much in return.

1:18:57 Yeah. When you do things like that, you know, there’s a pattern here between your success and your planning. I know there is. And if people are going to learn anything from this episode, it’s that. I mean, you know, it’s not like you stumble on these things. I mean, you sit back, you think about it, you hold your standards high, you have like a why when you go in, you’re like, why am I doing this? Like big picture, why? You want to be world class and what you do, you demand that. And yeah, it’s just very exciting to see you go into all these other places kind of, you know, not fearlessly, but you’re going in there like going for it.

1:19:26 Yeah. So that’s a beautiful thing. I always ask everyone here a question at the end. I’m going to ask you if you can make a phone call. This is actually probably about perfect to the 20 year old JB and give that young man a bit of advice. I guess you still in college. You haven’t met the other three guys yet. Give him a bit of advice. He picks up the phone. He’s like, yeah, what? And you’re like, I want to tell you something. What would you tell him?

1:19:46 Wow. I’d tell him to trust his instincts. I’d tell him to keep fighting. I’d tell him to learn as much as you can for as long as you can. You know, one of the things that I don’t regret, but I wish I’d done more of was, as I say, developing from a musical perspective in terms of my theory, my music knowledge, because I think it would have added so much more to myself and even to the boys. If I had that underground theory of music and even been able to develop and play live and add sort of a different level of musicality to what we did, I think it would have gone a long way.

1:20:27 And I think even now as an individual, some of the things that I want to do in terms of the book brand I’m looking to develop, which I’ve been working on for the last year or so, which is kind of going to be for young people, for little kids, but I’m hoping to involve music and incorporate music in that. I’d love to be able to do it all myself, to write the songs, and which I can do. I can do the writing of the songs, but actually playing and producing the music and saying, okay, well, this is going to evoke that kind of reaction, and this is actually going to evoke that different type of reaction and make people happy or make people sad or make people feel a certain way. And I think if I could have been more thorough, I’d have said be more thorough, really work hard. And we did work hard, but I think in hindsight, if I’d been a bit more thorough, it would have added more value.

1:21:25 You would have had more than 10 million records. Maybe. That’s a good sign of perfectionist. Just on that same note, as far as advice, best advice you’ve ever received could have been something you heard from Nick Raphael, could have been something you learned in the music business, or could have been something your mom said. Yeah, what’s best advice you ever received?

1:21:47 Good question. Did you get a good lesson about the music business at some point where you were like, yeah. Yeah, probably. As I say, my mom definitely gave me some incredible advice. You can definitely be number one. Someone has to be number one, so why can’t it be you?

1:22:06 Yeah, and I think of anybody who’s giving us advice and what they’ve said. That one’s very strong. We’ll give mom that one. Yeah. Very last part of that question, to that 20-year-old that’s watching this somewhere, been a huge fan of JLS, of you for so many years, who wants to get in the music business?

1:22:26 I’m sure you get asked all the time by people of 20 years of age. What advice do you give them? What do you tell them? I tell them to believe in their dream, very simply. I think, as I say, there’s lots of people who have visions and they allow other people to recreate and to live out and to fulfill their vision. But the truth is that only one person can have that vision. There’s lots of people that help you along the way and by all means, embrace those people and respect those people and allow them to help you. But never lose sight of what your original vision was and believe in that dream that you originally had.

1:23:04 JB, it’s been a huge pleasure spending time with you. It’s always fascinating to me when I get to speak with people like you and I’ve had Will Smith in the year. I’m sorry, Will Young, not Will Smith yet. Kimberly White, your friend, and it’s interesting because none of you stumble into success. There’s always this massive amount of work behind it. Everyone who sees an overnight success, you’ve probably heard that before, it never is. It’s always years and years of work.

1:23:31 These people have something and whether it’s they know how to deal with fear, they’re comfortable with risk, they have these plans on these pieces of A1 paper all over their barns. There’s always a lot of something there behind it. I think people don’t see that because they see you in the music video, they see you on the show and they’re like, yeah, I guess it’s easy for him. But it’s all based on a lot of hard work and a lot of commitment, a lot of faith and trial and error. It’s great to do that. Great to remind us of that. Thanks so much for answering the questions, giving us the insight. I want one of your turkeys for Thanksgiving next year. Definitely. Honey, if you’re watching this, get on the website.

1:24:06 Should they go to JBGill.com? Absolutely. All that stuff? Yeah. Honey, order the turkey. I want a nice big plump one. Thanks for everything you’re doing. I love this new look at farm and farming. I’ve got family and the whole business.

1:24:18 I think we need to respect where our food comes, our food, and then the people that grow it. I’m glad you’re doing this stuff. As we say on London Real, it’s about the journey. I wish you all on yours. I’ll see you again when you’re 40. Definitely. Thank you very much.