Davinci Jeremie - Bitcoin ETF Wins SEC Approval: How to Profit In The Crypto Bull Run

Full transcript: Davinci Jeremie on London Real

2:22 This is London Real. I am Brian Rose. My guest today is Davinci Jeremie, the software developer, entrepreneur, and crypto pioneer. You are considered a super OG in the blockchain space as well as one of the leading voices in the industry, having purchased your first Bitcoin all the way back in 2011. You famously published a video on YouTube in 2013 urging everyone to purchase even $1 worth of Bitcoin for their financial future.

3:01 You have said that our current financial system is nothing short of a massive deception that affects every individual on the planet while Bitcoin offers true freedom from the slavery of the central banks. You believe that the upcoming April halving coupled with a huge institutional demand will bring about a massive bull market. Davinci, welcome to London Real in Dubai. Thanks. Thanks for having me.

3:23 Great to have you here. I want to jump into it. You once said, quote, “You can actually change your life and build generational wealth in one crypto cycle if you play your cards right.” I want to jump into that, but I want to give people a little tease on that. Look, the big news of the day is that the Bitcoin ETF was approved, I think less than 12 hours ago.

3:45 Um, this is something everyone has anticipated and I wanted to get your thoughts on it because 13 years after you bought your first Bitcoin, now potentially massive amounts of institutional money is going to pour into this asset or not. We’ll actually get into that, but we’re talking about tens, hundreds of billions, some talking trillions and even tens of trillions of dollars potentially being poured into something that tracks Bitcoin. Um, you know, I don’t get to talk to many people that have been doing this for 13 years.

4:16 What is Davinci’s read on this big big announcement? Well, I was quite surprised that actually that they were going to allow this ETF at this point in time because this allows industry instit institutional players actually to buy Bitcoin. And I just figured that they’d wait until the end of the the cycle, but it looks like the institutional players had a lot of force and said, “No, no, no. We want it now.” So, so this is why it exists.

4:48 Of course, uh I’m wondering how much Bitcoin will be in this these ETFs. There’s 11 ETFs that have been approved and I would like to keep a track of how much they actually have and on the Phantom ETF that they sell. For example, when you it’s called um naked shortselling. That’s what it’s called. If you were to short sell a stock without borrowing the stock first, that that’s called naked shortselling to basically buy it back later to to pay back.

5:23 But with an ETF, that means there’s more shares out there than there really have in in Bitcoin. So that also counts as a count as some Bitcoin that exists. But this Phantom Bitcoin. So it’ll be interesting to see what how many is going to exist. Yeah.

5:42 Right. After this ETF comes out. Look, it’s it’s really interesting and I I’d love to dive in a little bit more. I um so at 22 years of old of age I moved from Boston to New York City and I started as a derivatives trader on Wall Street in 1993. So I learned about derivatives and at the end of the day an ETF is a derivative.

5:59 It doesn’t actually exist. It’s based it’s derived from the price of something else which and you know because you’re an old school silver and gold guy and we’ll get into that but you know there’s famous short squeezes in silver over the years where literally someone would corner the physical commodity and they could squeeze the future and there’s something very similar maybe could happen here and there’s a b bunch of unknowns that I think people don’t really understand about this they just think oh bitcoin bitcoin ETF same thing trillions coming in rock and roll but it’s not that simple and of course custody of Bitcoin on balance sheets is not a given whereas people could maybe hold commodities on balance sheets so it opens up more questions that it answers to a certain extent right and the market is kind of meh came off a little bit as Ethereum pumped and we can get into that but no one really knows what’s going to happen next that’s true always remember that that there will always be pundits saying including myself saying that what they know what they believe that’s going to happen but we don’t know we the future was unset, an asteroid could hit the planet and we would be all it does.

7:03 It’s all this is moot. But yes, yeah, that’s well said. So, yeah, people on Wall Street get paid a lot of money to convince you that they know what’s going to happen next, but nobody can predict the future. And so, never believe that because nobody really knows. Um, this thing came in.

7:16 It was interesting. So, I worked as a banker for 15 years. Um, I’m now paying for my sins by putting out content and trying to be more inspirational. But one thing I learned as a banker that people maybe don’t understand is that bankers care about one thing. They actually don’t care about preserving their, you know, their rackets.

7:34 They don’t really care about holding the financial system in the fiat prison. They care about their bonus that’s coming at the end of the year. And if you’re a client and you want something from uh commodity future to Bitcoin to crack, they’re going to get it for you. because if JP Morgan doesn’t offer it, the guy down the street at Goldman’s going to offer it. The guy down the street to at Deutsche is going to offer it. And so this, I think, was a reaction to a huge demand.

7:59 And at the end of the day, even Gary Gensler couldn’t stand in the middle of that because so much money was wanting in. And I think that’s why they just capitulated. Exactly. Um I met a guy in Dubai that said he saw Larry Fink of BlackRock at some conference six months ago and he said, “Yeah, Larry, but what about Gary?” And he said, “Don’t worry about Gary.

8:18 This is happening and that’s interesting right because you know who funds these campaigns who appoints the SEC chair there’s lots of things that we don’t know so you’re not necessarily bullish on this event you don’t think this is necessarily going to be good for Bitcoin and for this cycle yes of course it’s going to help this cycle Bitcoin actually do extremely well in this cycle okay um I’m just surprised that it happened but Hey, it happened. And uh I think they will have Bitcoin in this ETF. They can’t get away with no Bitcoin in this ETF.

8:55 There’s just no way. But they will have some. And certain players, just like the with gold, the gold ETF, you can actually withdraw direct Bitcoin with it. But um for the average person, they will not be able to. And that’s fine.

9:10 That’s that’s um that’s the market. That’s how we are, right? um certain people get certain privileges and others don’t, right? Certain people get bailouts, others don’t. So that’s the way we this this is the way we’ve designed our markets. And uh uh I really see that this is going to actually help the Bitcoin price go higher than my low ball number which is $160,000 was was without ETF approval.

9:36 Exactly. Okay, good. And let’s jump into this. So your call was about 160,000 in this bull market. Rough time where you think that might happen in 2025.

9:46 25. Okay. Mid early late. Yeah. Late uh maybe mid to late.

9:52 So okay. So September would be the probably September October November would be the time frame where this would uh end. So my mom is 75 years old. She lives in San Diego and based on yesterday’s actions, I think some of her pension fund might be going into Bitcoin. So, what would you tell her if she said, “Davinci, what’s the happening?”

10:14 What would you say? Because here’s the news. We’re going to have to start educating a bunch of baby boomers. And so, what’s the simplest way to explain that to them? Well, the happening, if you just ignore what the happening, it’s just you’re like, “What happening?

10:28 What does that mean?” Well, Bitcoin works like gold, right? and gold gets mined into existence. Well, Bitcoin gets mined into existence and the p the amount of go Bitcoin that gets mined into existence gets reduced by half every four years until there’s nothing. And that’s what the happening basically is, right?

10:46 Okay. And the supply of gold kind of goes up like 1% a year or something like that from mining. The mining stays steady at 2%. Okay. Uh if we have a huge price jump then it might increase beyond 2% but it generally stays at 2%.

11:01 Okay. And then so for mom this is for you. Uh for Bitcoin I think there’s currently been about 19.5 million Bitcoin mined a total that’s going to happen of 21 million and that supply every four years that supply is being dropped by half into where it just tails out in like 21 something. Right. Yes.

11:20 2140 is when it’s zero. It’s absolutely zero. Wow. And it’s only fees that uh the miners get paid with instead of the the the reward. It’s called a block reward.

11:32 Okay. Um but they could also get the block reward through the fees of transaction fees basically. So whenever you you people in general start transacting, they can get paid in fees um because you know you can set the fee. You don’t have to pay any fee. actually pay zero fee, but they might not add your transaction to the log, the ledger cuz it’s a market, right?

11:56 You have to have a the highest price to get served. Now, of that 19.5 million coins out there, the rumor is there’s four or four and a half million that are completely lost and will never be recovered. Um, I don’t know if that’s right, but that leaves 15, maybe going up to 17 left. You’ve got institutional money coming in, potentially massive institutional money coming in. Why isn’t this trading at a million dollars yet?

12:22 Well, institutions are not stupid, right? They they uh they know how to play this game. So, don’t be surprised if um we get a little bit of a pump that today is the the 11th. Um um I believe New York is waking up right now. Yeah.

12:38 Uh so I wouldn’t be surprised if we get an initial pump and then they just short the mofo out of it basically. Right. And so you know, as you know, they can do naked shortselling against the ETF, right? They can open up and start naked shorting that ETF, drive it down. Exactly.

12:57 To start buying it cheaply. Exactly. So, yeah. And do you think these institutions have been amassing positions over the last 12 to 18 months knowing that this was a possibility? Yes.

13:09 I think um I believe I’m going to guess on this that they took out Binance because Binance always had the liquidity whenever there was a problem there people said believe there’s a problem with Binance they had liquidity because they had a one-to-one ratio with uh Bitcoin or crypto that they had if you deposited one bitcoin they had one bitcoin if you took out one bitcoin they were minus one bitcoin it was always one to one ratio they never like um cook the books. Yeah, exactly. Or did fractional reserves.

13:42 Okay. So, the government probably didn’t like that and they want to take those bitcoins and move them probably into the ETF. And I wouldn’t be surprised if they said, “Okay, listen. Um you’re going to um lease us those bitcoins, right?” And what is what is uh it it’s it was done for gold leasing.

14:04 Um people don’t understand this concept. Um, leasing. Leasing. You do know leasing of a car, right? Have you?

14:11 Yeah. Have you ever leased a car? I never have, but you basically, you know, you borrow, you rent the car in like a a a term, right? So, a certain amount of time where you use the car and pay someone else, but you never own it. Exactly.

14:24 It’s effectively renting. And so, um, what’s happens is on the books of the, uh, the car company, they still own the car even though it’s in your possession. Well, gold and silver leasing works the same way. Um, they lease out the gold, right? They give even can give them the gold, but even though they don’t have the gold, it still counts as their possession.

14:48 And legally, by law, even though, for example, you are owed that that gold that they leased out, they don’t have to, no business has to um pay you directly the gold if there’s a default. they are only um they only have to pay you in dollars or the local currency that they’re all debts are uh owed are payable in the local currency. That’s just the way it is. And so when you give custody of your assets to a third party, they never have to technically if there’s some sort of um what would that word what is that word the French word force majour they don’t have to pay you the asset they can pay you the local currency okay got it all right so funny games can be played behind the scenes these assets and so because of that yeah probably that’s happening now.

15:52 Exactly. So, that’s how they can expand the supply of this asset without people noticing it so much. Okay. I had a guy named Mark Yusko on my show. He runs Morgan Creek Capital and he’s made quite a few investments in blockchain and, you know, he’s he’s really an old school TradFi guy who’s been investing in the markets for 30 years and he’s not, you know, uh, some weird conspiracy guy and I’ve had a few on my show.

16:13 And he said, Brian, right on the show, I didn’t even prompt him. He said, “I find the timing of FTX going down to be just too convenient. And I don’t believe some 28, 29, and 30-year-old did all that. I just don’t believe it.” And then again, they finally closed down CZ at this I mean, literally a week or two before the ETF.

16:32 The rumor was the ETF wasn’t coming out until Binance was down. And like again, the timing was perfect. So I again I’m not a conspiracy theorist but these timings seem a little too peculiar where they took all the people out that really were the pioneers and now perfect timing for the Tradies to come in for this instrument. You know they did that with silver ETFs. Did you know that?

16:54 I didn’t know that. Yes. That’s why your experience as a gold and silver guy are helpful. Not to mention the games they used to play with gold. People don’t realize in America it was illegal to own gold in America 1975.

17:04 Yes. I mean that’s crazy. So, they did the same thing with silver is what you’re saying. Um, they played crazy games with silver back. Warren Buffett, uh, he purchased a lot of silver at the lowest possible price.

17:16 Uh, I think it was like he got like $2 an ounce or something like that. And he was forced to sell. He said that he sold it too early. It was He wasn’t forced. He said He didn’t say he was forced.

17:28 He just said he sold it at He was He sold He was He was stupid. He said, “Oh, it was just stupid. I sold it at $7.” Yeah, right, buddy. the same amount of silver in your uh your Berkshire Hathaway is the same amount of silver in the ETF.

17:43 Okay. Yeah. Tell me another one. Okay. Okay.

17:47 So, there’s strange powers out there that get people to do things that don’t always make a lot of sense. And some of this is happening right now. Yeah. Okay. Exactly.

17:56 Let’s talk about You kind of alluded to it, but I think it’s a really important point maybe to talk about that people aren’t educated on. this ETF is going live today. All right. And so now all of a sudden, we’re going to have an ETF that is supposed to be based on Bitcoin, but as you said earlier, they don’t necessarily have to hold one:1 and these institutions can’t hold the Bitcoin on their balance sheet. And so what happens in the future? Maybe gold is a reference for this, but there’s this concept that the tail can wag the dog and if there’s if there’s so much ETF interest that just trades back and forth um that doesn’t settle against Bitcoin and then you have the Bitcoin underlying market, there can be a point where the basis between the two can be very significant, negative or positive, and it can stay that way for a long time.

18:41 Example, the the ETF might price Bitcoin 50% higher than the actual Bitcoin. And you might say, “Yeah, those markets will arbitrage.” But they won’t necessarily because the institution can’t buy Bitcoin as an ARB. No. So, I think people are a little um ignorant in understanding what this really does to the Bitcoin market because you could have these two shadow markets where the Bitcoin ETF doesn’t look anything like Bitcoin.

19:04 Yeah, that’s coming, but not in the f. It’s coming in the future. Explain this to people because you understand this well. Exactly. the silver. An example of that is the silver price back in uh 2008 during the financial crisis.

19:17 Silver plummeted heavily below I think it went below like $10, but you couldn’t buy it at that price. It was just no way. No one was selling it. Okay. You couldn’t even buy the the thousand ounce bar at the comics for that that price.

19:35 So there was no bid. There was no buyers. So I mean there was plenty there there there’s silver to buy. It was just not nobody was willing to sell it at the price that the commodities exchange which I call the crimex. Okay.

19:47 The way they were they were quoting the price there but it wasn’t a real price cuz nobody would sell it there. Exactly. And so the commodities exchange known as the crimex was like artificially deflating the price. Exactly. To have a print in the Wall Street Journal for what reason?

20:03 Well, here’s the thing, right? Silver is heavily manipulated and that was an example of it where you couldn’t buy silver at that price. You had to buy it at the at like twice the price that was marked and that’s coming for Bitcoin if the US dollar doesn’t collapse before that. But if there there will be a day where oh wait a second there’s no Bitcoin on the regular spot exchanges but the price is low and I want to buy some. that’s coming and nobody’s selling it because there’s a lot of people like me and Michael Saylor’s one of them, but I’m wondering how long they’re going to take him before they take him out.

20:44 Hopefully, he’s smart enough. He he he meets with meets with Elon Musk and learns a few tricks because I think Elon has has the government by the ball somehow and I don’t know how, right? He’s managed to escape all the lawsuits and things. Exactly. He’s been pretty good so far.

21:02 Yeah. So he might want to sit down with him and uh learn some tricks because uh they will be coming for him. There’s a lot of Bitcoin and uh I don’t you know about the silver short squeeze that h that um silver it wasn’t a short squeeze it was actually they uh had purchased a lot of uh bitcoin I mean sorry silver sorry in the in the 1980s the ’70s the hunt brothers remember the hunt brothers yeah they were based in Chicago maybe they were big in the silver and they took a huge position in the physical silver and when the futures expired and people had to deliver silver they couldn’t get their hands on it.

21:39 Exactly. What happened? No, what happened was the the um commodities exchange changed the rules and said that if you have a higher than 5% position, long position, you had to sell. And so they had to close out their positions, right? And um so and then they were charged for, you know, market manipulation.

22:01 They don’t charge you for market manipulation if you short it. All right. You can short as much as you like. M but if you go higher than 5% now uh ownership of any particular um commodity you are manipulating the market. So that’s the rule.

22:19 Okay. So we can expect a lot of funny games nonsense weirdness that spot bitcoin never had. So imagine if Michael Saylor goes to 5%. He’s going to be in trouble. So but that’s a lot of that’s that’s really high.

22:36 I don’t think he will get to 5%. But if he ever did, that would get him in a lot of hot water. I’m sure he knows that. Yeah. Okay.

22:45 So, I guess the message for everybody is we need to expect the unexpected. And as much as we wanted to be I mean, let’s be honest, a lot of the crypto world wanted the world to finally say that you’re right. And to a lot of people, that’s what this ETF means. It finally means that everyone agreed that you guys have been right. You’ve been going to your Thanksgiving and Christmas tables and being ridiculed by grandma and grandpa for 10, 15, 13 years and finally it’s there.

23:14 But and that’s all well and good and institutional money is coming in and now your mom and dad are literally going to have Bitcoin positions whether they know it or not in their pensions. The downside is that beautiful spot market that you used to enjoy that okay might have been volatile and there might have been whales playing games. At least it was a real spot market might now be overshadowed by an ETF that makes it do all sorts of weird stuff and Exactly.

23:36 Right. And maybe regulations and exchanges and stuff. I feel that yeah that uh the ETF may wag the be the the the tail that wags the dog. May we’ll see. We don’t know for sure.

23:49 They can’t do it with the the commodities exchange. Uh which happens the Bitcoin is the only commodity on the commodities exchange where you can’t accept delivery. So weird. It’s it’s insane, right? And to really get an understanding, you know, oil went negative, right?

24:04 Yeah. And you could actually That’s a great example. Exactly. And the difference between the silver when silver dropped to a low price and oil dropping to the negative price is that the reason why it did because there you were going to get that oil. You if you had that contract Yeah. that oil was coming to your house.

24:24 Right. cuz literally they they couldn’t deliver the oil, right, cuz it was coming through the pipes and they were going to start pumping it out into the the street and so they would pay you to take the oil. That’s how it negative. This is something really important for me to understand because people like why would you ever pay someone to take oil? Well, you will if it’s coming out of the pipeline, you need someone to do it. And that’s a great example of like a futures price in a because you had a contract that was going to deliver oil and you have no place to put it, right?

24:51 Yeah. So, you got a problem, right? So, you’re willing to take, hey, take this problem off my hand. I’ll pay you. So, that was the that was why it went negative.

25:01 But that can’t can’t happen with silver, gold, or Bitcoin because nobody will deliver those items to you. I mean, they’ll deliver gold and silver if you you really pull at them. Yeah. But Bitcoin can’t do it. Is the only commodity that will not be delivered to you.

25:21 Okay. The only one. Yeah. And again, just to give people a quick overview, like when you’re trading a futures contract, say it’s a 3-month future or a one-year future, the whole point is is that when it comes to expiration date, then you can, if you don’t close out the futures position, get delivery of the commodity. And that is there to ensure that there’s no funny business around that time with what’s the price of that commodity.

25:46 Because I worked in the interest rate markets for a long time and I traded EUR dollar futures and they price against LIBOR which is the London interbank offering rate and when I joined Wall Street it’s just like a short-term interest rate and you thought well it’s a rate and you take the average of 12 banks what could go wrong well about 5 years ago a bunch of traders in London decided to manipulate that price these are big institutions that were cheating and they could do it because there was nothing to deliver so this isn’t just a a point in passing in a derivative if you can’t deliver that thing. It means someone’s going to manipulate the price of that on delivery date and they could move that sucker 10% 20% negative and you’ll be like, “What the hell’s going on?”

26:26 Go look at the ETF. That’s probably what’s going on. So, this is what’s coming, right? Exactly. I mean, it won’t come right away, but it’ll take some time to to manifest itself.

26:36 But um yeah, I I I it’s amazing how I they I think about that commodities that change, but I understand where they might how they try to rationalize it because um with regular commodities, if you buy some corn and and the farmer can’t produce the corn um and he defaults, he can’t produce it. He can pay out in cash. Right. Right. the if all else fails, they they can pay out in cash when the contract comes and expires.

27:08 And so their logic is, well, why don’t we just everything just pay out in cash? But wait a second, we the point of of any commodities exchange is so that when you have legitimate hedging needs, so for example, a farmer is a legitimate hedge. He’s trying to predict uh he doesn’t want to predict the price of um of of um corn. He wants to have a specific amount of money today and he’s going to produce the corn tomorrow so that he knows how much he can spend and so forth.

27:42 So he he can um project that into the future and the per on the other side someone want to consume the corn they want a fixed price over a certain amount of time as well. So this is why we have the commodities exchange and this is what this is the benefit of it. It’s not something that’s just for only speculators. Speculators are just in between. Yeah.

28:02 They’re the ones who taking the risk, not the the consumer and not the producer, right? So that’s what it’s for. And so when we have the Bitcoin ETF, it’s all 100% speculation pretty much. I mean, yes, you can use it to hedge. However, that requires a little bit more work and fancy footwork, but you can use it to hedge, but it’s not as good of a hedge as if you can receive the asset directly.

28:31 Right. Right. So, that’s the problem. Yeah. So, we should buckle up to have some weirdness going forward.

28:38 Okay. All right. I appreciate you explaining that. Gary Gensler had a weird day yesterday. Um, I think he started off the day by saying that just No, I think he started off the day by saying that that wasn’t our tweet from the SEC that approved the ETF.

28:53 I mean, again, the internet wins again or crypto wins again. And then at the end of the day, I believe he said that even though the SEC has approved the Bitcoin ETF, the SEC does not approve Bitcoin. as in we do not recommend you invest in Bitcoin or crypto even though we have approved the SEC which again looks like Larry Fink just told him what to do because that’s clearly a mixed message. What did you make of Gary’s mixed message when all this comes out?

29:20 What do you make of Gary in general in that role? Just your thoughts. Well, Gary Gensler is a paid hack. I mean, one way he he’s one way time he’s he’s for Bitcoin and then another time he’s against it. He’s just getting paid.

29:35 He taught at MIT a course in 2018. It’s on YouTube. I watched the whole thing 24 hours. And guess what? It’s surprisingly good.

29:43 He’s really well-versed in it. And at the time, he was saying that, you know, Ethereum is not a security and all this stuff. And then you look at the Gensler now, it’s like a different dude. It’s a different dude. The now it’s political Gary Gensler.

29:57 Exactly. Who’s running for office or Treasury Secretary and he’s just towing some other party line. It’s actually like Jekyll and Hyde, right? Yeah. I mean, yeah, he sees a paycheck either or is getting one or sees one in the future and so that’s all he’s working towards and and working for.

30:14 So, and the government gets what the government wants. The government doesn’t like Bitcoin. So, they are trying to actually hate on Bitcoin doing their best. They have even what’s called a uh document uh that leaked. It’s called Choke Point 2.0 you know, where they have a choke point, right?

30:36 Yeah. Whole uh plan of attack on Bitcoin. And uh so I I that’s why I was surprised this ETF actually came out. I part of the choke point is that they they couldn’t let this ETF come out so soon. And so yeah, I guess they had too much pressure from people with big money.

30:57 Greedy bankers. Exactly. Because they don’t care about the financial system. They just care about getting more money. Exactly.

31:05 Never underestimate a greedy banker’s desire for his bonus. I I kid you not. I was one of them. I worked with them. That is the most important thing.

31:14 Nothing else. Not, you know, like choke point. Not what the not what the institutions want. It’s them looking at, you know, not a 10 to $15 million bonus, but you know, $100 million bonus. So, I guess that pushed it through.

31:25 Um that’s the beauty beauty of the government is that they um they never let um they never go and manipulate things directly. They always organize laws so that they can get a specific outcome. Okay. Right. Right.

31:40 They use regulation. Exactly. To get the outcome they want. But sometimes it backfires and this is one of the times it backfires on. Okay.

31:47 That’s well said. Now look before this uh conversation you you asked me to ask you some hard questions. So, I’m going to ask you some things that I’ve heard. Was Bitcoin created by the CIA? And since you were early mining it, are you in the CIA?

32:01 Well, if I was on the C in the Come clean on London real first off. Yeah, I’m Canadian, right? And I was born in Trinidad. Perfect cover, right? If you were Russian, it’d be even better.

32:16 Okay, so yeah, unlikely. Hey. Um, okay. Did I I work for the CIA now? I was there when um bit when um what was his name?

32:28 Um uh Jesus Andreas. No, it wasn’t Andreas Antonopoulos. It was somebody else. It was another person who was working closely with Satoshi and I now the name has not Roger V. No.

32:38 Okay. Somebody early on. Yeah, exactly. I know. Yeah, I know one of those guys.

32:43 He he went to to the CIA office to explain what Bitcoin was and and everybody was freaking out. I remember back then. When was that? It was back in 2011. Okay.

32:51 Um and that’s when Satoshi said, “Okay, no, no, no. I’m out.” Okay. All right. So, was it created by the CIA?

33:00 I don’t think so. Um I think that um based on what I learned about the source code, it was created by somebody in the NSA really. And um the evidence of that is the randomizer. What was quite interesting about the randomizer a randomizer is that a computer has a hard time making up random numbers because it’s an exact from my early programming days. You have like a seed but it’s hard to actually make it yeah truly random.

33:31 And so there’s lots of um code or actual people have come up some methods that uh produce a random number true random number from a computer. And so there’s lots of a certified method that’s stated that they don’t have any back doors. They’ve been checked and rechecked and they’re certified to not have any back doors. Yet Satoshi didn’t use any of them. All the certified methods used this obscure method which wasn’t certified.

34:07 And a lot of developers scratched their head until Snowden when he released that oh yeah the NSA had back doors to all the certified randomizers with enough data they could actually re reproduce the random number that you actually chose. Okay. Does that mean they can they can break codes? Tech tech thing. They can break Yeah.

34:34 Break all the security get in cryptography. Get your Bitcoin basically. But Satoshi chose the one randomizer. They didn’t have a back door. How is that possible?

34:45 Did he get lucky? I don’t think so. Okay. So, if he’s NSA, he knew their tricks and he decided to build something that they couldn’t break. He was probably just versed as a developer.

34:55 He knew what they could do. And so he said, “Okay, well, I’m going to use that one. That’s all.” Right. Okay.

35:01 And because he was tired of watching, you know, the the banking system get away with murder and printing money and, “Oh, yeah, we’re going to uh to do these crazy derivatives and wipe everybody out, wipe ourselves out. Oh, we’re too big to fail. Can you give us some money, please, government?” And yeah, everybody gets paid. They all got their bonuses.

35:20 Yeah. So, he’s he was sick of that. And that’s why that’s how um Bitcoin was, right? It was born out of the 2008 mortgage crisis crash. And he even etched in that Financial Times headline in 08 or 08 or nine.

35:32 Yes. I I mean I was I did the same I tried to develop the exact same thing when I realized what was going on and I was told by everybody, oh my god, you’re stupid. You can’t can’t solve the double spin problem. Cuz I’m a software developer as well. So you tried that in ’08?

35:51 Yeah. And it’s a funny thing of 08 0 2009 and um and uh I got discouraged by my peers and I should have pushed through because probably would have found Bitcoin eventually if I pushed through and I was a little little disappointed with myself. Now that’s the next question. Are you Satoshi Nakamoto? No.

36:13 And even if I was Konichiwa Satoshi even if I was Yeah. I wouldn’t tell you because I would be dead. You think he would be dead? Oh, for sure. Really?

36:25 Oh, for sure. Who would kill him? I don’t know who per se say in the in in the specific persons. But here’s the thing. If you look throughout history, you’ve seen most assassins of presidents, right, have c have been because they tried to stop the banking system, stop our um the fractional reserve, the the central banking.

36:52 Most assassinations were because of that really. So if that’s the case, you know, you mess with them and in fact Kennedy, we were talking about that earlier on. Yeah. I think Kennedy um was killed because he um wrote into law um it’s still there on the books but it was uh rescinded uh executive order 11110 that the United States is now switching back to silver as money and using the treasuries um because they had a large holding of silver as money in there started.

37:34 He wanted to print silver notes. Interesting. I thought he was trying to abolish the military-industrial complex, although they’re very closely related, right? Because that’s all the money. Um, yeah, but you could look up that that that um that it’s on the wiki page.

37:51 Check it out. Yeah. Some say the fact that Satoshi is this unknown mythical figure is how Bitcoin remains so robust and strong. Because if we knew who he was or even if he was a real person somehow it it might make Bitcoin less I don’t know legitimate. Is there a truth to that?

38:11 Because a lot of people have said that from Andreas Antonopoulos. There is something having that mystique there somehow makes it cleaner doesn’t it? Yes I think so because a lot of people they associate Ethereum with Vitalik. Now if Vitalik were to die Ethereum would plunge but it’s still a solid product. Nothing’s changed, right?

38:33 Yes. The developer has died, but Right. It’s still good. It still works. Right.

38:39 Right. But people associate um because we we are human beings. We like to connect with people. Yeah. Right.

38:47 We like to feel that that that person is got my back. He’s got taken care of me. Yeah. Right. And if he’s gone, he’s not taking care of me anymore.

38:56 So why should I hold his assets and stuff like that? Yeah, why should I hold that stock or whatever? So that’s why that’s another reason why you and then of course he’ll be hero worshiped, right? Yeah. Um people would look to him to answers like people look to me for answers and and sometimes it gets annoying, right?

39:18 Because the number one question I get, the number one question and everybody asks and I jokingly say nobody asked me that is, “What’s the next cryptocurrency I can buy so I could be a millionaire one day?” Really? Yes. And what do you tell people when they ask you that? That’s your most most asked question.

39:38 Yes. And I say, “Nobody asked me that. Wow. Jesus, this is incredible.” And then I say Bitcoin, right?

39:48 And yeah, you could buy, but it’s too expensive. Yeah, you could buy other cryptocurrencies and they can go up 100x, but you got to be right twice. Once at the low bottom and once at the top, and the odds are you’re not going to be right twice. Yeah. Right.

40:02 So, just buy Bitcoin. Buy Bitcoin. Wait for it to to do its thing, and you will you won’t regret it. Honestly, I I I I often tell this story about my my my ex-girlfriend and um she I bought her some Bitcoin. She bought like spent like $3,000 worth on Bitcoin and a whole bunch of other cryptocurrencies.

40:25 What year? In 2016. 16. Okay. And um she forgot about it.

40:31 She forgot she I gave her all the passwords when we broke up and so forth. and uh I knew she she would not remember them. And so I kept them and then like 8 years later she’s she’s calling me up and saying it was like more than not it wasn’t eight years it was like um it was it was uh yeah it was seven years or something and she’s like hey you remember those um those bitcoins do you do you do you have the password to them because I lost it. I’m like, “Bitch, you’re a millionaire.”

41:05 That’s the name of the show. [expletive] you’re a millionaire. I love it. Okay. She’s like, you knew that before you even open the accounts up? You just knew.

41:15 Exactly. And did she Was she shocked? Yeah. Yeah. She had $1.2 million.

41:19 And did she spend it all 3 months later back to where she was? No, she she she sent it to another brokerage firm. She sold it all, sent it to a brokerage firm that was obviously scam. and I told her it was scam and she wouldn’t listen and then yeah, lost it all. Funny how that works, huh?

41:34 Funny how that works. You got to almost kind of earn that money to keep it. Um, all right. And so you tell people just buy Bitcoin. And you told people back in 13 to buy a dollar’s worth of Bitcoin.

41:45 That gets confused. You didn’t say buy Bitcoin for a dollar. You said just buy a dollar’s worth of Bitcoin because you knew over time this is an intelligent way to make money and you’re going to spend that dollar on something stupid anyways. So, you’ve always been telling people to get in on this asset and nobody listened to you. You even guaranteed people’s money at some point, right?

42:03 Yeah, that’s right. I have a video out there um where I guaranteed people’s money because I was so confident that this was going to work. You said buy $1,000 worth of Bitcoin and if it goes to zero, I’ll give you your money back. Yeah, exactly. It’s pretty good.

42:14 You said like two people took you up on it. Five. Five. Okay. And two of them gave me a hundred Bitcoin thanking me um years later.

42:26 Many years later. Yeah. Okay. Very, very. So, speaking of OG days, I was watching your videos last night.

42:34 It was crazy. I mean, you are there early on. First of all, it’s weird because lightning strike twice. I mean, one thing for you to be involved in Bitcoin. The other thing for you to be a YouTuber back then.

42:44 I mean, I uploaded my first video, I think, in 2007 on YouTube. I think it was riding on the back of an elephant in Africa. And then in London Real’s first video was 2011. There weren’t many people creating back then at all. So, not only were you early on Bitcoin, but you were creating crazy stuff.

43:01 You got pictures of your minds in your home. You even recruited your your niece or something who’s a pretty good actress. Yeah, she was an actress. She’s actually done movies. Really?

43:10 I mean, she was pretty good. And I mean, you cut that in the beginning. I mean, you know, it’s not exactly People don’t remember. You couldn’t record on iPhones back then. Editing software was hard.

43:19 Microphones were hard, but you did it. So, take me back to those days. Do you ever watch those videos? Look at that guy. Who was that guy?

43:26 Well, um, the reason why I I didn’t want to do these videos, I didn’t want to get onto YouTube. What got me on to YouTube was uh once I read about how our financial system works and how it transfers wealth from the poor and the middle class to the rich through the inflation and that it it was not sustainable and it always ends in massive disaster meaning that the the middle class gets wiped out and then we have desperatism and so forth because the the top uh 1% which currently is not nice people, right? Whether you believe that conspiracy there doesn’t matter.

44:05 They’re not nice people because our system is a means of theft. Legalized means of theft. And so do you think people who know how to steal are good people at the top? No, they’re not. So, how did you know this?

44:19 Because people forget there weren’t YouTube videos back then. There weren’t podcasts back then. So, to learn this is very hard to do. You got to find books. You got to find groups, right?

44:28 Like people don’t know, I’m talking like an old guy. You don’t remember what it was like, but it was hard. So, how does a guy like you, especially in the software or engineering field, learn about money in such a way that you’re convinced and see what now most crypto people know is true? Inflation’s like printing money steals from the poor. How did you know that?

44:46 Well, I um first off, I heard what what got me interested in this and realizing that I didn’t understand money was um a presidential debate. Ron Paul was um I don’t know why I was wear watching a Republican debate because back then I was a socialist. Really? Yes. That’s a surprise.

45:04 Okay. Okay. And uh I’m looking at this this this old guy and he’s saying how you know our financial system is unfair. Tries wealth from the poor and the middle class to the rich. He said exactly that.

45:16 And I’m like no it doesn’t. Why would the government do that? They’re not good. They’re not evil. And uh yeah, as a socialist, you know, you don’t know anything that’s going on, right?

45:29 You don’t you don’t know anything. And so they said on the on the show, the the moderator and everybody said, “Yeah, yeah, that’s true.” But yeah, and they just moved on. And it was like it was like it was nothing. They agreed and it was nothing.

45:43 I’m like that was my moment I knew that I didn’t understand something. And so I started researching and I read the book, The Creature from Jekyll Island. And you know what? I first tried to go to a library to get the book cuz I couldn’t even order it. And um I the library was only a reference copy only.

46:05 So you couldn’t take it out. No conspiracy theory here. Exactly. Okay. And so I’ve heard of that book before.

46:15 Jim Rickards, who wrote Currency Wars, very famous book, is on my show a lot. He references that book. He’s the only other person that’s ever referenced that book on this show. Really? Wow.

46:24 Wow. Okay. So, that that book is very difficult to read. I would if you I when I spent my time I spent six months reading it and most of the time was stopping and looking up all the statements he made in the book and trying to understand what he was saying because it was so um technical and difficult to follow um because of all the financial terms like acceptance and all that kind of stuff and what happened on Jekyll Island and basically the Federal Reserve was created on Jekyll Island back in 1911 1913.

46:58 Well, I mean the the meeting was in 1911, I believe, and then it was passed in 1913. Okay. In the um Jekyll Island, I mean, what a perfect name. Yeah. And uh so once I read that and understood the financial system, actually I had a little bit of a of a breakdown because I understood it and it gave me a massive headache.

47:22 That was actually, you know, I just realized that was when I first started having migraines. Wow. I’ve never had migraines. Your world as you assumed it was just crumbling in front of you. Exactly.

47:32 And you realized that we’re in this we’re in this prison. This economic prison. Exactly. It was it was difficult for me. And I actually went to I stayed I spent a day in the hospital because they they said that I was like under severe stress.

47:49 Probably wanted to take you out. He’s probably watching you read the book. Oh no. But get the guy. Get the guy.

47:55 And then my my brothers, my family thought I was crazy when I was saying, “Hey, you know, they printing m the government prints money that or really the banks print money when you go and borrow it. That’s insane. That why would the government allow that, right? That doesn’t make any sense.” I mean, it was it was hard for me to to con I wasn’t convincing anybody in my my my own sphere and back then there was no Wikipedia.

48:21 There was no YouTube videos. So for most people There was YouTube in but nobody was talking about it, right? I mean, it was just kind of YouTubers and stuff. There was no like long form stuff. So, you probably really did sound like a crazy person to everyone.

48:35 Exactly. Exactly. And I understand that now looking back. Yeah. And that used to work back in the day to keep everything the way it was, right?

48:41 Because you have mainstream media saying this, schooling system saying this, you can’t research must. So, it just means the weirdos are called weirdos. That was you. And so I started the YouTube channel only because I felt that I should contribute something to this because um uh as a child growing up, I I watched this uh this video of of this little boy who was on a beach um after a storm had passed and there was this the beach was filled with fishes, fishes everywhere and he was throwing fishes into back into the water and and this little girl comes up to the little boy and said, “What are you doing?”

49:27 And she says, the boy says, “I’m trying to save the fish.” The little girl looks around and the whole beach is just covered with fish flopping around. How? What does it matter? There’s so you see all the fish here.

49:43 Does it matter? The little boy says, “It matters to the fish I save.” and she continued to help him throw fish into the into the ocean. So that reminded me that I should be a voice in this, that I should do something. And I was still afraid to do something. I didn’t want to be I didn’t want to be famous.

50:08 I didn’t want to anybody to know who I was cuz I’m a software developer. I’m really an introvert, actually. Yeah. And so most YouTubers are, by the way. Yeah.

50:19 Really? Yeah, they are. Think about it. Most YouTubers are introverts. Wow.

50:22 I never thought about that. But yeah. And then and then I I remember reading about how, you know, for evil to persist, it only requires good men to do nothing. And so I had to start my YouTube channel and start this journey. And I’m glad I did.

50:43 Wow. That’s epic. It’s really epic. It’s very hard for people to put themselves out there on camera. I know I teach people all the time and nowadays when everyone’s doing it, it’s still hard.

50:53 And back then again for introverted people, but you did it anyways because you knew it had to be said. What did you learn from that book? What is the Fed? What do people need to know? I mean, I’ve heard people say there’s a Federal Reserve.

51:06 It’s not Federal. It’s not a reserve. It’s It’s What What did you learn from that book? I learned a lot. But what do people need to know?

51:16 Um, let’s make it basic for people. Imagine you came up with the way to create money for free. You’d be like, “Yeah, right.” And you’d go you you’d probably go on a little bit of spending spree, right? And then and then and but you don’t want people to find out, right?

51:40 Yeah. You you don’t want people to understand that you’ve created this system of free money for yourself. That’d be in that’d be insane, right? Because then you’d go they try to stop you. Don’t want that, right?

51:54 Well, that’s why they started funding schools, universities at first. They were paying for the universities, the people who created the the Federal Reserve. And then they realized in order to make sure that, you know, the universities did not teach people how money works, right? Then they had came up with the Keynesian economics and stuff like that, right? And so that was a key thing, right?

52:19 And but then you realize, wait a second here. Why am I spending my money that I printed? They worked hard to print. Why don’t we get the the public, right, to demand the government give school get schools and we get the government to enforce our rules of how we teach people and teach them nothing about how money works. In fact, we teach them the opposite.

52:47 We teach them Keynesian economics which has no logic at all. Like I I love Keynesian economics is a point where the broken window uh helps build the economy and and I’m like the idea is that if somebody breaks a window repairment comes out produces new glass and then that means there’s generates economic activity. Um you destroyed a window that was actually a capital. The window is capital and when it’s gone that’s capital loss, right? So that’s not generating economic activity that’s taking away from uh the economy.

53:28 And so it’s obvious, but that’s what they teach you. And then most people just go, “Oh, okay. That’s just how it works, right?” Yeah. Yeah.

53:36 Yeah. If that was true, then why don’t we just print money, dig ditches, and put them fill them in? Or why don’t we just forget about digging ditches and filling them in? Just stay at home. Break everything.

53:46 Everybody. No. No. We don’t We don’t even break everything. We just print money and give it to everybody and then we’ll be all rich.

53:54 Wait a minute here. That’s right. Who’s going to work produce? Right. So that’s the problem.

54:01 Okay. You said that the dollar is the ultimate shitcoin. That’s what you said one time. Yes. Yeah.

54:06 And you said my dream is that all fiat currency goes away because it’s a scam. It’s a means of theft and should go away forever and never come back just like slavery. Yes. That’s so true because it is slavery. Think about it.

54:18 If I give you the ability to print money for free, you enslave the rest of us because we have to work for it. It’s simple as that. And so if you disagree with slavery, it has to go away. And I think your audience does disagree with slavery, right? Yeah.

54:37 So this has to go away. We’re 110 years later, 110 years since the Fed was created. And I’d say most people are none the wiser. No. because now it’s been institutionalized in our schools. Again, I asked I am good friends with Robert Kiyosaki.

54:51 I was I talked to him last night. He wrote Rich Dad Poor Dad and he says schools teach us to be poor. And whenever I ask my students, did you ever you ever been taught about money? They always look at me. Robert famously raises his hand when he was a kid and said, “When are you going to teach us about money in school?”

55:07 And they said, “No, no, we don’t teach money.” He said, “You’re teaching me chemistry and Spanish and history. Why don’t you teach me about money? Mhm. We don’t do that in schools.

55:15 No. No. That’s not by accident. Mindboggling. That’s not by accident.

55:18 I mean, if you have the ability to print money, you’re going to make sure that nobody knows that you can print money, right? Okay. It’s that simple. All right. Simple as that.

55:30 Wow. So, you got that idea. You tried to develop your own Bitcoin. Then, when you saw Bitcoin, you were primed and ready. And you were like, I’m going all in on this.

55:39 I’m turning my house into a mining rig. And then you preached. You got a lot of hate and as Bitcoin cycled up to 52 and back down to two, you got more hate. Yeah, it was $32. 32 and then right back and then you got more hate and then continued and you just weathered the storm.

55:56 Yeah, exactly. I mean, I was 100% confident that this is going to be the money of the future. I was 100% confident, still am. Unless an asteroid hits the planet and wipes us all out. I mean, the likelihood of something going wrong with Bitcoin is the same odds of an asteroid wiping us out.

56:16 So, don’t bet on that the asteroid and don’t bet on Bitcoin failing. So, uh that’s why you want to bet on it succeeding. Some people say now that Bitcoin is not an invention, it’s a discovery just like fusion or fish or something like that. And if I I talked to Michael Saylor, I had him on the show twice. Interesting.

56:33 The second interview he he was now starting to talk as not only as Bitcoin as digital property but he started calling it digital energy. Now he graduated from MIT about 3 years before I did and he really started to think of it a way of of a means of taking energy and converting it into this financial instrument and again as more of like a discovery. Do you agree? Is it something like that? While money is uh a means of converting human labor energy into a savings into a mechanism that’s portable and safe that that can be used later on.

57:10 That’s what money is designed for originally is because you you can’t um save your crops, right? If you have a massive amount of crop of food, you can’t save it all. Yeah. For a long term. So you have to sell it today or within a certain amount of time.

57:30 And what? Sell it for what? To get what exactly? And this is where money comes in. Money has to be something that converts all that energy and work into something smaller and portable that you can use later.

57:46 And it doesn’t matter whether it’s Bitcoin, gold, silver, shells. It just has to to function as a a means of saving for the long term, right? And so once it functions as that, you want to know if well can other people accept it? Can can other people identify it as a valuable item? Can can they can they split it up into smaller pieces?

58:16 Right? And and there’s a word for it’s called um divisibility and fungibility, right? To see if that make sure that fungibility is like is one piece the same as the other piece, right? So that like one chicken is not the same as another chicken. So that chickens are not fungible.

58:33 Yeah. But gold is and shares of Apple stock are and Bitcoin are right. And then of course it can you transfer it to other people. Now we can transfer Bitcoin which when which gives the Bitcoin the powers is that we could transfer to anyone in the world instantly. But more than that, for the first time ever in the history of mankind’s invention of money, right?

58:59 And we’ve invented several types of money. This type of money can be owned by a thing, by a computer. The computer can own it. Your computer can’t own dollars. No.

59:13 Always somebody has to be authority over those dollars. Whether it be the bank, the government, or another company or you, right? But it’s always somebody else. That’s someone somewhere down the line is the authority of those those that money. If it’s physical cash, you’re the authority of that physical cash.

59:34 You can’t give your computer physical cash and hey, can you like send this to somebody on a certain time? No. Yeah. Well, now you have effectively physical cash that your computer can deal with and manage in such a way to make you even more. Think about that.

59:55 Now, it goes beyond just, you know, having the computer automatically make you some money. You could have robots and machineries and cars, everything make you money and you don’t have to work. They could work for you. So if you understand that, you better buy a lot of Bitcoin because a lot of our jobs are going away and AI just supercharges what you’re talking about. And so if wealth you have to understand the wealth is is a storage me money is a storage means of wealth and money that’s really good store not only stores it for a long period of time but but also increases its value because your labor today is worth the most today and worth the least tomorrow.

1:00:47 Why is that? Is because we innovate. We produce. we we come up with new technology that makes your labor today less valuable. So for example, if you were someone who’s digging a hole, a very deep hole with a shovel, the back hole, right?

1:01:07 Destroyed your job, right? But before the the back hole, you could have saved enough money in the future to all of a sudden, wait a second, you’ve saved it, saved it, saved it. I now can buy that back hole because of the amount of labor. The value of that labor was the same as the backhole. And so that is what you’re getting when you have good money.

1:01:36 You’re storing your future wealth. And it’s usually going to be worth more because we innovated because we created something easier, faster, better. And so you want to buy as much Bitcoin. Now you have this opportunity of a lifetime to buy an asset that will be money. Absolutely will.

1:01:59 Right. And store your wealth in it. And in the future when we use AI, robots, and all that kind of stuff, you’ll be using micro fractions of that. That’s why I say if you just get 0.28 Bitcoin, odds are because the way people are because they just can’t save the saving. One of your your audience, if you’re just an average person and you’re watching this video uh later on, please take the time to learn how to save.

1:02:35 Find videos somewhere on how to save because that’s the most important thing to learn. Yeah, it’s not a coincidence that people can’t save either, right? I mean because of our financial system the financial system requires you to spend spend spend and also because the money is going down in value and you intentively spend because you feel that if I save this it’s just the value is disappearing so I’ll just buy right now enjoy my life now right you said that sound money actually creates more wealth because people know the money they’re getting is going to last longer yes that was the interesting thing I never heard anybody say that so when people know there’s found money like Bitcoin, they’re actually more willing to do work and create things and do better work, right?

1:03:17 And do better work than the inflationary dollar, even if they don’t consciously understand it, they subconsciously know it’s not really worth what it is. And so they they phone it in, right? They don’t really create because they know somehow that whatever they create and earn is not really worth it, right? So sound money actually brings out the best in people. Exactly.

1:03:37 This is why in in the the 40s, ’50s,60s when when the United States was the number one economic power is because they produced the best stuff. Everybody the best toasters. Toasters lasted 25 years. You’d be lucky if it lasts 25 days. Now, that’s down to the soundness of the money.

1:03:57 You think that’s heavy, man. That’s deep. That’s very deep. Okay, let me play devil’s advocate with you. Um, right now Bitcoin is not being used as money.

1:04:07 El Salvador, for example, not being used as money. I had this argument with Michael Saylor and I said, “Look, it’s not being used as money cuz people don’t want to spend it. They want to hold their Bitcoin.” And I tried to get Michael to agree that we needed some type of stable coin that people could use as a transaction. Now, Michael, he’s not I wouldn’t call him a maxi, and I want to get your thoughts about maxis later, but he’s definitely a huge fan of Bitcoin, but he kind of agreed that for someone’s wallet, they might need something besides Bitcoin to spend.

1:04:35 What do you say about that? Can it really be an instrument of money in the future with the volatility at stake, etc., or do we need something in the middle? No, we don’t because the volatility comes from the dollar. Really, the dollar is volatile, not Bitcoin. If you look at it that way, right, you can look at it that way.

1:04:57 Yeah. Yeah. I’m not crazy. You’re crazy like you back in the day. You can look at it.

1:05:03 That’s actually true. You were not crazy. They were crazy. So, okay. So, but if you you’re saying, “Well, wait a second here.

1:05:09 How can we have like uh you know, businesses contracts and so forth?” Yes, you’re right. Under the current volatility of Bitcoin, you can’t have that those type of contracts. And I agree with that 100%. But there will be a day when you know just like gold, Bitcoin’s volatility is 1 or 2%.

1:05:31 And so currency today, the US dollar against all other currencies fluctuate 1 or 2% a day. So it’s the same thing. And once it gets to that level, then you could have contracts in that asset in Bitcoin. And you could have you can pay people in in Bitcoin, but it’s not there yet. And when it’s there, it’s too late to buy.

1:05:57 Don’t be looking for huge gains, right? But you can save in it, right? But don’t be expecting to um oh yeah, I’m investing in Bitcoin. There’s no such thing as investing in Bitcoin once it’s a stable currency and you’re getting paid in it directly, right? You’re not investing in it, right?

1:06:14 So, buy Bitcoin now is what you’re Exactly. You’re investing now because you’re predicting like I am that it will be money, right? Okay. Okay. You’re predicting that eventuality.

1:06:24 And in the future, we won’t talk about the price of Bitcoin. And Max Keiser has asserted this as well and I have a long history with Max we could talk about but he said in the future we’re not going to be saying it’s worth a million or 10 million because fiat currency will be so irrelevant we’ll just be talking in bitcoins right or it’ll be so useless it won’t even matter exactly but for example do you talk about the price when you were in United States for example do you talk about the price of dirhams where no no what’s the price of a dirham when you nobody talks about that or vice versa even Here we don’t talk about the what’s the price of a dollar here. Right.

1:07:02 True. So yeah, it won’t be relevant once you get it paid. Right. Right. Once the world you’re just doing you’re just doing you might have to do conversions for the local currency of the government before trying to force you into their local currencies.

1:07:14 Okay. But that’s about it. So one day Bitcoin will be the currency but not today. It could happen in the future. This cycle you predicted 160,000 before the ETF was approved.

1:07:24 After the ETF. I’d love to find out where you think it’s going to be. A couple questions. How did you get to 160? What do you think it will be and what do you think about the other coins?

1:07:34 One thing I find refreshing about you, Davinci, is that you talk about other coins and maybe we can get into the maxis at some point because a lot of OG Bitcoiners don’t want to talk about it. All right. And a case in point, Max Keiser, I love Max. Came on my show in 2013, was yelling and screaming at the time. I didn’t know him.

1:07:50 I met him on Twitter. That must have been funnier that interview. I thought I was gonna have a fight with him because I was like going back in front of Twitter. I was like, “Is this guy legit?” And I was like, I remember I wrote, “Would the real Slim Shady please stand up?”

1:08:03 Cuz I wanted someone to talk about Bitcoin in London. And he sent me a message. He’s like, “I’m coming over tonight at 6:00. You better be ready.” I was like, “Oh my god, that was going to be a fight.”

1:08:10 He comes on. I really like Max. Got on with him and Stacy. I bought a Bitcoin in 13. He transacted a Bitcoin at my Thanksgiving dinner table in 2015, I think, for $1,000 with a Goldman Sachs trader.

1:08:21 And then when I started my academy in crypto and DeFi, he refused to talk to me because I was talking about something besides Bitcoin. All right. So, we’ll get into the maxis. You clearly are open to talking about other things besides Bitcoin. Um, why do you feel that way?

1:08:37 You mentioned Ethereum earlier. We saw a big Ethereum move on the back of yesterday’s approval. What are your thoughts on the other cryptos? Um, yeah, because B Max has said because he’s close with the the president of El Salvador that he’s going to throw all shitcoiners into jail if they go down there. He said that.

1:08:56 That’s what Max is joking about. I don’t doubt he said that. Don’t doubt it at all. I know Max, but he’s just he’s just, you know, he’s just being flamboyant to for entertainment sake. Really?

1:09:07 We love Max. Yes, we love Max. Yes, we do. And so, um, here’s what I think about other cryptocurrencies. I think that we need to have them in existence because competition is good.

1:09:20 It means that um we’re going to try other ways and see which one works. And if Bitcoin doesn’t change to that new way that that works, right? It will die. If we stick with only Bitcoin, it can’t it can’t innovate fast enough. Okay?

1:09:42 That’s why we need to try other things. And I believe that there is not one use case for cryptocurrencies, means of payment systems, right? Cryptocurrencies can be used as like an a security can be used like points can be used to to do like to for for your customer base for like loyalty points, right? For and and and have value that way. They’re less like an NFT, right?

1:10:11 NFTs, I know they’re a little bit confusing, right? Most people say, “What? I’m paying how much for a ge JPEG? What? I just got a copy of that?

1:10:20 See, I got it.” But you you don’t understand the concept of ownership. Yes, I can copy the Mona Lisa to exact replic exact specs. Get a artist to paint it exactly, but it’s not the original. That’s the difference, right?

1:10:35 So, and the increase in Ethereum and all the NFTs have actually helped pull Bitcoin up, right? Because it’s onboarded more users that end up buying Bitcoin. Exactly. And not only that, right, um I’m learning new ways of of uh you know, securing a blockchain, right? Uh there’s so many ways than just the Bitcoin’s method of um securing a ledger.

1:10:59 A ledger is is what Bitcoin is. The blockchain is just a sto sequence of records of who has what, right? That’s what a ledger is open to the public. Exactly. Then we could all see who has what.

1:11:13 You don’t know whose name is behind it, but you know somebody’s got that, right? And it’s verified by proof of work. All right. So, these are all part of the ecosystem. They’re all necessary and they’re all in experiments and then they help innovate in competition.

1:11:27 Okay. Take that, Max Keiser. I’m looking for you, Max. I love you. innovation, right? More innovation competition.

1:11:34 Okay. And so just to those two questions, um post ETF approval, what do you think the Bitcoin high will be and why? And then also what do you see happening in Ethereum and what other things are you looking at? I know you look at web 3 games quite a bit and in GameFi we have quite an a few investments in there and with Animoca. What do you see as being some of the big things coming up?

1:11:54 First Bitcoin production and then Well, I f first the Bitcoin price. I think that 160 is the low end. $160,000 um is the low end and um up from 69 the last cycle because it’s a big increase because um because basically it’s 10x from the low that’s easy achievement for Bitcoin especially when we have the this ETF now I think that’s now pretty much a walk in the park okay the minimum level right that’s the minimum level right now okay um and then there’s because there there’s just the sheer number of money that’s coming and and and people will both buy the ETF and buy the physical Bitcoin like myself and Michael Saylor.

1:12:40 And I’m just I’d like to see uh a tally of how many pe people actually own all those ETFs. I want to see that. But anyways, we talked about that earlier. Top end top end of Bitcoin 300. Top end, I would say we can get as as high as half a million.

1:12:58 Okay. Plan B is calling for 524,000. Yeah, it’s possible. But I I think the real the real thing you want the real date you want to hold on for Bitcoin because Bitcoin there’s only five 5% of people 5% of the population in the crypto and 2% of that whole Bitcoin. 2% of the population, sorry, 2% of the population.

1:13:20 So imagine when that moves to 13%. See where I’m going? I’m with you. And so there’s going to be a bubble to end all bubbles because this asset, can you imagine what’s going to happen when every single person is buying Bitcoin? They’d be like, “Oh, you got to buy Bitcoin.

1:13:38 You know, they’re not making anymore. They’re never going to have anymore.” People say that about land. They’re not making anymore. Well, Bitcoin, they’re definitely not making anymore, right?

1:13:48 It’s a fixed number that you can count on and everybody can get it easily. Not everybody can buy buy land. True. But every single person can buy Bitcoin. Every single one.

1:14:01 You’re like, “No, they can’t. It’s so expensive.” Yeah. You know, understand the visibility. Yes.

1:14:08 I know you don’t want 100 one 100 millionth of an apple, right? But you can do that. You could have one 100 millionth of a Bitcoin and you’ll be it’s it’s it’s still going to be worth something. That’s the whole point. Okay.

1:14:26 All right. And so because you could do that and anyone could do that, imagine what’s going to happen in the future when people are all saying, “I get it. I get it.” Are you buying more Bitcoin now? Yeah.

1:14:42 I mean, I was like after reading Nassim Taleb’s book, uh, Bitcoin Standard, I’m like, uh, damn, I’ve got to buy I don’t have enough Bitcoin. Oh my gosh. You try to buy more always. Always try. I’m like 100% into crypto really, but uh I’m I’m heavily heavily I have more than 70% in Bitcoin.

1:15:06 Okay. What else happens on this cycle? Are you bullish on Ethereum? Are you bullish on other layer 2s? Are you bullish on web3 gaming?

1:15:15 Are you bullish on ordinals, BRC20, DeFi? All of the above. All of the above. Shiba. I know you talked about Shiba, but like you must have some more than others, right?

1:15:27 Yeah, of course. The um the ordinals pro probably do extremely well. Um the uh gamify. Okay. Social.

1:15:35 I’m looking for a new social fly to take over um uh all the rest of the the systems out there like for example Instagram and uh right and Facebook and all that kind of stuff that that social will rule the world right uh because it will be decentralized. Yeah. And so no one will will shadowban you anymore. Yeah. No censorship, right?

1:16:01 No censorship and ownership of your followers and your comments and your likes and your connections, your social graph as Danny Kulichef of Lens talks about. So, all right, bullish on that. Gamefy, let’s talk about Ordinals and BRC20 because this brings the maxis in. Um, lately the maxis like Jimmy Song who’s been on my show and Jimmy Song. Jimmy.

1:16:23 Yeah, I think it’s Jimmy. The guy with the cowboy hat. Um, and Max Keiser and a bunch of others are against it. how dare you come and soil our beautiful pristine ecosystem. Um how do you feel about it?

1:16:34 Other people say the miners are getting paid and other people say look it’s technology they can use it how they want. Um it’s also super popular and people are saying that if you want something like a real world asset why not have it on the mo most robust chain in the world. So what are your thoughts? Yeah, I agree 100% that if people want to use it for that price will decide if they should use it for that period. Uh one of the things that happens um a lot is governments like to control price and and and people in general basically they they think that if prices get too high it’s a problem.

1:17:13 No, no, no. The pro the the solution to high prices is high prices. The solution to low prices is low prices. As simple as that. Capitalism.

1:17:24 It’s not that complicated. If we have a flood and people are price gouging for they like say price gouging for gasoline. Good on them. That means somebody outside just a few miles away saying what you’re getting how much for that gasoline? I could bring it over there for cheaper for half that.

1:17:45 Yeah. It’s a free market. The solution to high prices is high prices. Let it go. Okay, let it go.

1:17:53 I mean, some people are talking about banning it and forking it and all of those things. Jimmy Song, that was the name. And did you know that this happened before? This has happened before in Bitcoin’s history. It was a game called Satoshi Dice.

1:18:07 People were using it and they thought it was a spam on the network. Where’s Satoshi Dice now? It’s because it got too expensive to use it. Price solves everything. Amen.

1:18:22 Take that, Keiser. Right. I agree. Right. These people can’t come in.

1:18:27 And again, I hate it when someone tries to come in and control something that was built by Satoshi not to be controlled. Right. It was built so one person or a group of people can’t. I know it’s human nature, but it’s I always find it quite, you know, quite ironic when the Bitcoin maxis try to come in and try to do something that is not in the spirit of Bitcoin being created, which I think Satoshi would welcome other blockchains, right? Exactly.

1:18:53 Would Okay. And and yeah, they did the same thing with uh Ethereum. I think it was a big mistake for them to control the price of the uh the gas fees. Uh, you can’t mess with economic law. Let it be.

1:19:10 It will fix itself. Yeah. We mentioned Satoshi earlier and you said he might be assassinated. If he wasn’t, he’d probably be thrown in jail. And if he wasn’t that, he’d probably be character assassinated by somebody.

1:19:21 I mean, they would really go after him, right? Because he would be the figurehead and then if you discredit him, you might be able to discredit the network, which is completely ridiculous cuz tech, right? You wouldn’t discredit networks any more than you discredit math because somebody the person who who invented some sort of mathematical equation happens to be a pedophile. Does the math add up? Yes.

1:19:43 Okay. What is the matter what what he did? Have you been to America recently? They can do that. I know what you mean.

1:19:50 I mean, you know, as a as a scientist and engineer, that should be pure. It shouldn’t have anything to do with anybody else. But these days, you know, people manufacture narratives around this and they try to put a black mark on this kind of thing. Um, luckily that’s probably not happened with Bitcoin. You said once that you should have a goal beyond your lifetime.

1:20:07 You said that that’s really important. Yes. What did you mean by that? Well, we always want to achieve something in our lifetime. Always.

1:20:18 I want to be rich. I want to to uh be an athlete. I want to win the gold medal. Have you ever thought whenever you did that when you do those things you have to pay the most highest price? It means you have to be better than everybody else.

1:20:33 And then when you get there you realize that frig this was that that sucks. Is that that all there is? And so if you have a goal that’s beyond your reach just always beyond the reach and you have to plan further out beyond your lifetime. And you could see, you don’t know for sure if it’s going to, but you have to always put in all kinds of plans in order to make sure that that that dream when you’re dead is achieved. You have to foresee a whole bunch of other variables that other people can’t foresee.

1:21:09 You’re always thinking about that idea, that solution that’s when when that you’re when you’re dead is going to function. You will you will make yourself the best version of yourself every single time because that’s the only thing you are get to take with you hopefully when you die is the version of yourself that you pushed yourself to be. It’s also the best way to actually contribute to humanity because if it’s a goal past your lifetime, you’re not going to get credit.

1:21:45 It’s not going to really be about you. You’re going to be giving something back almost by definition. And that’s the people that I’ve met on this show. People that are most fulfilled are contributing somehow. Yes.

1:21:55 But a lot of people are selfish in the sense everybody’s selfish in some way. Of course, right? Yeah. And so the best way to look at it is, hey, you’re helping improve yourself, not humanity, right? Yourself.

1:22:09 You’re getting the most out of it. You are going to be a superhum and go beyond you right and everyone else happens to win too. Yeah. Yeah. No, it’s well said.

1:22:26 It’s well said because like you said, ultimately a human will only act if it’s in their interest. And people that try to paint it and virtue signal and all that. At the end of the day, it’s it’s still in your interest. Charity is in your interest because you feel better. But if you can recognize that and put it beyond your reach, you’re probably doing good things and do something you’re happy about.

1:22:45 So many people have these goals. I want to win a gold medal. I want to make a million dollar. And they get there and they they feel extremely empty and unfulfilled because it’s kind of fell in love with the dream sometimes. You know, Nichi once said, uh it’s it’s the desire, not the desired that we actually love.

1:23:01 Exactly. We love to to feel that desire. Yeah. And so you will always have the desire if that goal is outside of your reach. Right.

1:23:10 So try to engineer that, trick yourself in that way, in a good way. It’s really good advice. Um, you attended the premiere of my documentary film a few months ago. Carl the Moon was there as well and um, there were a lot of people there in the crypto community and I felt like you guys really got it and I didn’t really know who would get the movie and we talked about it afterwards and you know won’t spoil the movie but it’s a movie about freedom of speech.

1:23:37 It’s a movie that questions governments, centralized institutions, kind of what happened during lockdown and co and stuff like that. And it seems like Bitcoiners and crypto people see the matrix, if you will, or see centralized government with a little more suspicion than the rest of the world does. Um, why is that? Do you feel that way? Obviously, you read Jekyll Island a long time ago.

1:24:02 Have you seen through many many things that a lot of the people didn’t see coming including what happened in 2020? Yeah, I did. Um because a lot of things I saw even the 2008 financial crisis uh coming um because I learned what money was. I learned how our banking system worked and yeah, I remember back in 2008 betting I I had I took two weeks off just to watch the financial crisis. Wow, that’s crazy.

1:24:27 Like it was two months back. I was like I’m like I told my boss, “Yeah, I’m taking these two weeks because our all our banking system is going to collapse.” And he’s like, “What? Yeah, AIG is gone. They’re they’re like that’s wild.”

1:24:40 They’re looking at me like they got two heads and I’m like, “Yeah, I’m going to watch that, right? Cuz this is going to be entertaining.” So, so I was working in the city of London and I was a broker dealer and I felt like I had a front row seat and my clients were leaning and they were literally down the box and I could watch their stock price that one day go $2, $130,50 and then they called down and said, “Brian, they’re throwing us out of the building.”

1:25:02 And I thought, “This is the greatest show on earth.” Like, I had a front row seat. So, I know how you feel. But you took two weeks off to watch it. It’s even better than me.

1:25:10 I already had a seat. Um, so you saw that coming. Yeah, I saw that coming. Okay. And and that was interesting because like when I was telling people I was like always telling my family members they were like looking at me like wow.

1:25:23 Like I remember sitting at dinner and in a restaurant and this lady’s starting to freak out the cuz I was explaining what was going to happen. Crazy man. Yeah it was funny. This one person in my office he said I’ll bet you $1, one loonie that this is not nothing’s going to happen. And yeah it was funny.

1:25:41 I was like when I came back into work I was like I guess so I owe you loonie so funny but yeah it I I did see that and then I also saw that this pandemic was a pandemic at first I thought okay you know what whatever the government tells me is not going to be the truth so I better do my own research cuz we always tell people to do your own research right? On YouTube when we talk about crypto or trading or whatever, do your own research. So, I did my own research.

1:26:17 It took me a while, right? And I immediately got a mask on and I was the first person in Chile. I was living in Chile at the time walking around with a mask. People were looking at me funny, right? And uh because you know I understood that you know it’s passed around, right?

1:26:33 People’s like sneezing on each other and yeah, it does pass that way, right? But once I found out it’s an RNA, I learned an RNA virus and then I learned how an RNA virus works and then how you can treat an RNA virus. I took the mask off because you just need zinc and an ionophore, which is which you can get in wine, red wine, um what’s it called? Vegetables. If you eat a lot of vegetables and you eat a lot of and you have even zinc’s found in vegetables, so you’ll be all right.

1:27:07 Go figure, huh? You don’t need some fancy custommade BS pharmaceutical drug. No. Okay. Sure.

1:27:14 Yeah. No, it was ridiculous. If it was a DNA virus, we’d be in trouble. But it’s an RNA virus. And even if it was a DNA virus, a vaccine is the way to go on on a DNA virus because um DNA viruses don’t change.

1:27:31 Got it. Okay. As long as it’s a good one. All right. So you were conditioned to question everything, do your own research.

1:27:38 And so I think a lot of the crypto community saw through a lot of this whereas the normal public was just in reaction mode. That’s true. Probably right. Yeah. I mean it was sad that you know I did some videos explaining what you can buy in order to to get rid of this virus if you got it.

1:27:57 And that got shadowbanned and like you know you know Yeah. I know. You know I know you know you know what happened. Oh, my favorite is what I I did a video saying don’t eat bugs and um that got me a strike, right? Um just in the German market because um I I do videos in German um as well.

1:28:20 So uh the for the German market and that that channel got a strike and there was no appeal is because you are talking about health and what people can eat and I’m like I just suggested they don’t eat bugs. That’s crazy. That’s the WEF plan I guess that you’re pushing. Um tell me more about the crypto community here in Dubai. Um I’ve had Carl the Moon on the show twice.

1:28:47 Love Carl and I know mm crypto and when I came here I was introduced to everybody in the community including yourself and everybody was really welcoming really brought me in and it’s a really tight community but also one that you know kind of welcomes the strangers they also look up to you as kind of the I’d say kind of father figure they give you a lot of respect h how did how did that happen how did that create because I I know communities and I think there’s a you guys have a very special one here yeah it just organically happened. I mean, I I started with um with Chris, a member in crypto. He was the first person to interview me after I became really famous in 2018.

1:29:28 Uh I remember coming back from Miami and and uh everybody was messaging me um uh saying, “Dain, did you see on the news? Everybody’s talking about you.” And I’m like, “What? Huh?” And uh yeah, this person posted on a Reddit that this guy knew about, you know, 2008 this and all of I even had a video about get out your money out of empty Cox.

1:29:54 It’s collapsing. And so yeah, this this this uh this Reddit post just blew up and everybody wanted to interview me. And the first person to interview me was Chris from MM Crypto and he got me this medallion and it has the date December 14th, 2018. Um it was when we did our first interview together and the rest is history. It’s beautiful.

1:30:16 Can we see that medallion? Can you point it up for the camera? Sure. And can you show the the ring as well that you have? These are these are epic pieces.

1:30:23 So basically he made it exactly like the ring. I had the ring before and he made the um the medallion like the the the ring and so uh yeah I appreciate that Chris. Thank you very much. This is one of my favorite pieces. And normally I don’t wear jewelry but uh ever since you got me this I really been appreciating it.

1:30:42 It’s gorgeous. I remember when I first met Chris or the second time I met him I I noticed the one he was wearing and I was like damn that’s pretty fresh. you know. Yeah. Yeah.

1:30:51 Once once he got me this, he said he had to get one for himself. So, yeah. That’s super cool. Yeah. Chris is the man.

1:30:57 He’s really really nice guy. Amazing guy. The most nicest person you’ve ever met. Yeah. And so these he kind of pulled you in and you soon became kind of this really tight special community here.

1:31:09 Dubai and kind of greater Dubai, right? Yes. Yes. He was always the one who’s trying to get me to Dubai every single day. Who’s like, “Come to Dubai, habibi.

1:31:18 Come come.” Wow. Wow. And so, you know, let’s talk about Dubai. You moved here three years ago from Chile.

1:31:25 What’s it like being here? Is it the center of crypto? Is it the future of crypto? You know, a lot of people are drawn here in crypto. What’s your take on it?

1:31:34 Why did you come and and is it those things? Well, first I came here to open up a business and because I was just going to open up a business because that’s what he finally convinced me to just okay, just open up a business here and you could use it for tax purposes in Chile, right? because you know there’s still there’s taxes in Chile and I decided yeah fine I’ll do that and I came here and I got trapped here because the it was in the middle of a pandemic and they closed the borders and no one was allowed back in although I heard it was the best place to be and I was yes I was quite h first I was sad but then I got happy about being here because I realized I I can take my crypto and get cash right away. In fact, I asked this person who was doing OTC, “How much can you possibly do?”

1:32:26 And he said, “$10 million.” And I’m like, “Really?” So, do you have security for them bringing that? No. Just bring it in the case.

1:32:35 What? It’s Dubai, man. It doesn’t happen in Chile. Doesn’t happen in Chile. Doesn’t happen in LA for God’s sakes.

1:32:45 Jesus. Okay. I’m like, what? Oh, man. So, that and many other things made me realize that this was the place to be.

1:32:55 This is the safest place to be. It’s the safest place for women for for your your jewelry. If you if you like fast cars and expensive jewelry and you don’t want to worry about, oh, should I take that off when I go outside? This is the place to be. In fact, you can not only um you could have like a really multi-million dollar watch place it somewhere in any restaurant, leave it and come back and don’t worry, it’ll be there.

1:33:23 It’s amazing. It’s amazing. And crypto-wise, it’s crypto friendly. Binance came here, businesses came here. Is it still kind of also bridges east and west?

1:33:33 Is it still the place to be if you have one single city in the world to be for crypto? I would say so because of the the zero taxes is really the key thing and you know businesses they’re opening up for crypto left right and center here. I mean making it easy for businesses to operate. Yeah. I was talking to Dr. Marwan Elzeruni.

1:33:52 He sends his love by the way and um he was like Brian you know we we were early on blockchain. We were you know we were putting things on experimenting with blockchain early on. He’s like we made mistakes in blockchain. He’s like we’re always innovating here. We’re always open-minded to all sorts of things.

1:34:07 And they move fast. Yeah, this is the beauty of of Dubai is that they they open up for everyone and u and it also is the negative because they open up for not so good people as well, right? So, the downside is you get the riff raff coming in and they’re they’re giving crypto a bad name by trying to use it as a means to do bad things or take people’s money. Yes. Exactly.

1:34:32 So, there is crime. It’s not like it’s completely crimeless here. There is crime. There is like more of like fraud, criminals and people who are defrauding you and stuff like that. So it’s not the panacea that people like to make it out to.

1:34:47 Okay. But it is better than most places. Okay. All right. So you’re staying.

1:34:52 Yes. Okay. In fact, and you know what? Every time I leave Dubai, I think of every I go somewhere and I go, “Huh? It’s not Dubai.

1:35:01 It’s not Dubai.” Right? We see all the things it doesn’t have to buy. Yeah. Well, I’m here for the month.

1:35:09 I hope when I go back to London, I don’t see that. But I think I start I will start. Yeah. There’s a lot of beautiful things here. It’s it’s really it’s weird, Davinci, like the West seems to be going off the end.

1:35:19 I mean, I was hanging out with a a big influencer at the Burj Al Arab, and he was telling me how you get your watch stolen in broad daylight at the Mandreon Hotel in front of the doormen right there. Met another guy yesterday who was in London. He said he had lunch at Nobu, walked outside with a $2 million watch on, of course, but two guys in a motorcycle came up, one pulled out a gun, which doesn’t really happen in London, and took his watch. And so those are getting worse.

1:35:49 And then Dubai is like this place where people come where it’s, you know, completely the opposite. Wow. Very strange, right? So yeah, I mean, even Chile has gotten like that. It wasn’t before. when I before I left um and then when I went back to visit last time which was in August everyone um was telling me hey Davinci it’s not the same here it’s not the same people will come up on the bike and take a take your stuff it’s not the same not the same that’s the the key thing that everybody would say me tell them tell me and when I’d meet them they they’d tell me how I’m doing blah blah blah and then they say hey you know what it’s not the same here you got to be careful and I can’t believe it it’s happening Not just not just in London, not just in Germany or United States.

1:36:36 It’s happening everywhere actually. And it’s I think it’s all because of the pandemic and even effects of the fiat currency system somehow. Yes, of course. Secondary and yeah, because the the pandemic caused them to print money which caused and then stopped everybody from working which caused more money uh in the system which caused prices to go up and these people are not working. You see the connection here?

1:37:00 Yeah. Yeah. How long do you think it takes until things break? I mean, this is going to be a crazy year. We’ve got elections.

1:37:07 We’ve got rumblings of civil war in America. Canada is on a crazy level as you know. China there. My friends call all my friends call it China now. Really?

1:37:17 China in Canada. Okay. All the surveillance and everything. Okay. And then we got AIs coming in and deep fakes and not being able to trust the news and trust the media and trust what we’re seeing.

1:37:27 And that’s just going to get worse. Um, what what do you predict for the future in the next few years and even 10 years from now? What do you think it’ll look like? Well, you don’t want to know. Mayhem.

1:37:40 Yes. Because there’s there was an experiment done with rats where you you shock them where you um you put them in a cage and you shock them but leave them in one spot that not shocked. They’re going to obviously move to that. But uh if you continue to shock them and they don’t know what’s where it’s coming from, they can’t deal with it, they can’t stop it, they eventually turn on each other. And you’re I’m beginning to see that, right, where people are being upset about, you know, oh, you didn’t get the COVID vaccine or you didn’t do this or you’re not with the the this the LGBTQ2 whatever whatever nonsense that they’re talking about.

1:38:22 And you’re not pro this, you’re not pro that. And they’re pushing you hate. Oh my god, scared. Look out for this. Look out for that.

1:38:30 Oh my god, this is a there’s so much fear and so much anxiety. And when that is a means of shocking people and that will lead to a spark that will cause a lot of riots and mayhem, right? You see the protests that well the protests that they’re not being seen in France, Holland, right? You have to look for those. Yeah.

1:38:56 But all that is part of the shocks to the system, shocks to people. And when they continue to do that, there’s going to be a spark which causes massive mayhem. And I’m afraid they’re going to go into martial law. And that’s when they probably reset the currency. The lockdown was already a form of martial law.

1:39:21 Yeah, exactly. But uh Yeah. And then that’s when they reset the currency. All right. So, get ready.

1:39:27 But again, you’re right. Fear causes us to be easily manipulated. And when they divide us and we fight against each other, we’re even easier to manipulate. And we’ve just we see this playing out like a playbook. Oh, yeah.

1:39:40 But when you’re in a state of fear or panic, you can’t think, right? So you just respond with those emotions. So it’s hard it’s hard to see it sometimes. Now we’ve just seen a beautiful case study. A lot of people God opened their eyes over the last couple years, but you dial up the fear again and it’s just so easy to push people around and so we have to be aware.

1:40:00 Exactly. It’s that’s that’s what I’m afraid they’re doing. And I’m well they know what the end result is. there’s going to be some sort of spark and I hopefully you know that’s something turns it around but I don’t count on it. You know I I’ve had some experiences with lack of freedom of speech and I’ve had people like Yat Siu of Animoca Brands on my show who says ultimately it’s all about digital property rights.

1:40:25 Do you own your physical property? Do you own your digital property? Because without that ownership you have no freedom. Without that ownership you have socialism, not capitalism. And it’s maybe a subtle point, but it’s a really important point.

1:40:40 And those digital assets include Bitcoin, your identity, your browsing history, your medical history. Exactly. And if they try to take that away from us, uh or as we saw in Canada, if you attended a trucker strike, you could have your financial assets taken away from you at a bank. Exactly. What what scared me was that they were going to take away my passport because I donated to the trucker strike.

1:41:02 Right. But you had Bitcoin at least. Yeah. Most people don’t. And so if you are not ready to buy some Bitcoin or some digital assets on the back of listening to Davinci for this whole time, if there’s one thing that maybe will get you to open your eyes up, it’s that your freedoms, all your freedoms, your financial freedom, your freedom of speech, freedom of choice, all that can be taken away from you like that.

1:41:26 You think you got money? No, the bank has the money. Yeah. You think you have a passport? No.

1:41:30 The country issues the passport. But if you own something like Bitcoin in a decentralized way on a wallet, they can they can’t take that away from you or it’s hard. Yeah. It’s really really difficult. Yes.

1:41:41 And so yeah, I that’s why I suggest people save in Bitcoin because they can’t unlike Ethereum, right? They can’t point a gun at anyone and make changes their change say that you don’t have that. There’s no way to do that, right? with Ethereum they can uh kidnap Bezos and put a gun to his head and say turn off the AWS servers and put a dent in it. No, no, no. It’s more of um they can get a hold of Vitalik and a few other developers, key developers because the way Ethereum works is that it’s they have to distribute an update to everybody and so they can convince them through conversion to make changes and it’s been already done before.

1:42:26 Um I don’t know if you heard of the DAO. Um back in the earlier days, um there was a a um a um an investment that everybody poured into called the DAO and it had a a hole in it in the contract smart contract and Vitalik decided to roll back the transaction and place no no place a code in the in the um that’s permanently in record inside the code that says that transaction of somebody taking Those those Ethereums did not happen. And because it can be done, right?

1:43:06 Right. One person can override this supposedly decentralized marketplace. Exactly. Right. So that’s why you always want to default to Bitcoin because that can’t be done.

1:43:18 No. It’s the only cryptocurrency where it can’t be done. Right. Speaking of a final Bitcoin critic, you got someone named Peter Schiff who was actually on my show, funny enough, back in 14 talking about a market crash, which he does. And he’s been on my show since.

1:43:33 And Peter Schiff um uh at least publicly doesn’t like Bitcoin. And he’s doubled down, triple down, quadruple down, and down again on the back of this approval. Hey, now you’ve got a way for more people to gamble on it. Yeah, he’s trying to secretly long Bitcoin. I don’t know.

1:43:49 Um I like Peter. I talked to him. I could tell he’s he’s really Yeah. What do you say to someone like Peter who says this is more greater fool selling it to another greater fool. This is more just speculation upon speculation and one day it’s all going to come crashing down.

1:44:02 What do you say to someone like that? Well, I mean it’s you can believe that if you want, but let’s let um uh reality be our judge, jury, and execution financial executioner. Okay? You can believe that other opposite side if you want, but I’m going to believe this side where Bitcoin is going to be money and we’ll wait and see who’s right. That’s it.

1:44:27 That’s it. Amen to that. Amen to that. Um Davinci, I really appreciate the time. I appreciate you going all in back in the day, putting stuff out on YouTube when that was a hard thing to do and nobody was doing it, especially as an introvert.

1:44:40 Um, final thoughts for anybody that’s here, whether they’re new to Bitcoin like my mom or whether they’ve been in Bitcoin for a while or, you know, still don’t know what to do, don’t know who to trust. Final thoughts. Yes, please do not trust someone who pretends to be me saying I’m going to help you invest in Bitcoin, right? Because it’s not me. It’s not somebody who is delegated by me.

1:45:10 I would not do that and neither one of my friends. That’s the number one thing. I want you to go to one of the name brand exchanges. I don’t care which one. Just like Binance, OKX, Bybit, whatever you choose.

1:45:24 And you buy it there. You start there. You open up an account there. So, start with that. Don’t even buy some.

1:45:33 Open up an account at one of these exchanges. Just go and do that today. and then another day go and send some money there. But first take the first step, right? Because you don’t want to be the person who says, “Yeah, I I I remember hearing about the Bitcoin on London real and I thought it was a good idea, but uh I didn’t do anything. Please do something.”

1:46:06 There’s an old Japanese proverb that says there’s two good times to buy Bitcoin. One is 11 years ago when Davinci told you to. The other one is today. There it is. I told you so.

1:46:19 Oh my god. There we go. The funny thing is the funny thing is I had a video saying that I don’t want in the It was in March of 2011. I said I don’t want to to tell you say I told you so in the future. That’s not going to help.

1:46:34 It’s true. It’s true. Well, look, the the Bitcoin ETF has just been approved. Now, it has the blessing of, you know, somewhat of the SEC, institutions are coming in. This is real.

1:46:53 And yet, you can still buy some now actually at a reasonable price. You don’t have to buy an entire Bitcoin. You can buy it any amount that you want based on everything we just said. Why wouldn’t you get some right now? The same amount of Bitcoin you can buy, you’re going to spend on a round of drinks on a weekend, put it in Bitcoin now.

1:47:11 Get to understand the asset. It’s just a no-brainer. Exactly. That’s the message. And if you can’t save, learn how to save because that’s really important.

1:47:19 I know it’s difficult uh saving. A lot of people have problems with that and you need to take that step first. Yeah. Amen to that. Davinci, thanks for doing what you’re doing.

1:47:27 And I hope you keep doing this for the next couple decades. I’m sure you will. I will. And uh let’s keep pushing. Thanks for the time.

1:47:33 Thanks for your thoughts. Thanks for having me on. Appreciate it. Appreciate it. Take care.

1:47:46 Cheers.